Did I really get 92% efficiency????

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MyQul

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I made my third BIAB, a basic brown porter after cooling down the wort just before aerating and pitching I took a hydrometer reading - it was 1.063, it was estimated to be 1.048 :shock: Brew mate says that this gives me a 92% efficiency, I was aiming for 70%

I did a 90 min mash and stirred every 30 mins - I understand stirring the mash help get efficiency up. I also made sure the mash temp didn't drop below 66.

I did a mash out at 76 degree c for 10 mins - not sure whether this helps with efficiency but i did it anyway

After lautering I gave my grain bag a really good squeeze - I'm talking wringing the grains and bag till they were begging for mercy not just a little press - I understand squeezing the bag also helps with

Because I wasn't sure whether my brew length water, plus boil off water plus grains would fit in my 20L pot (as well as being worried about a boil over) I just mashed with my 10L brew length water and did a dunk sparge with the extra water that would be boiled off - squeezed the bag again and poured the sparge water and running into the pot

Would all this get my efficiency so high or have i made a mistake in calculations somewhere. I tested my hydrometer with water and its fine

jim361.png
 
Have you wrung the grain bag dry on your other brews? If so how did they taste?

I did this when I first started brewing AG before I knew what I was doing and read about the grain forming a natural filter and it's this I blame for that homebrew "twang" like you get in cheap kits in my first couple of AG batches.
 
My first couple of BIAB's I cocked up as I was working on imperial gallons and the receipe was in US gallons and converting from 5 to 1 gallons further skewed things so I thought my effeciency was way down so I did a load of googling to find out how to get my efficiency up. I don't think it was in reality too far off target

I read during my google searches some people say that squeezing the bag causes tannins to be released (that homebrew twang you were talking about?) and some people say it doesn't matter. With my next efforts I think I wont squeeze the bag and just lauter, for comparison. I think, if I really did get 92% efficiency, making sure I keep my mash temps and stirring every 30 mins should at least be enough to hit a 70% efficiency target next time.
 
Stop, Stop, Eject ...

Tannins are extracted when temperatures are too high (its a chemical not a physical process).

If you're mash/sparge is too hot, then the tannins have already been extracted out of the grain, it doesn't need squeezing for you to do that.

Squeeze away to get most out of your bag.

{Breathe out & relax}


I love the other web misapprehension of "well, BIAB isn't as efficient as real AG" :-D
 
pob said:
Tannins are extracted when temperatures are too high (its a chemical not a physical process).
:-D

I've been squeezing my bag more after reading this somewhere, but do you happen to know at what temp tannins start to be a problem? Ta

Also, I'm celebrating having just achieved 70% efficiency for the first time with BIAB #5 (been floundering at 65% up till now).
92% is the stuff of dreams!
The only thing I did different this time was to increase mash time from 80mins to 90mins before mash out.
Do you think mashing for an extra 30mins or so would have a further significant increase in efficiency?
:hmm:
 
My best so far has been 91.8% efficiency. I do like you do. A mashout to 75C and a mini sparge using just 4l of water at 80C. So I can totaly believe your figures. Your method is slightly more rigorous than mine. I sometimes go to the Hawkshead brewery bar where they have a board detaiting their last brew. They can get efficiencies as high as 98%!
Makes you look like a real lightweight :tongue:
 
pob said:
I love the other web misapprehension of "well, BIAB isn't as efficient as real AG" :-D
I love the other web misapprehension that you need high efficiency to make great beer :D

I go out of my way to make sure that my efficiency is no higher than 75-78%
 
Aleman said:
pob said:
I love the other web misapprehension of "well, BIAB isn't as efficient as real AG" :-D
I love the other web misapprehension that you need high efficiency to make great beer :D

I go out of my way to make sure that my efficiency is no higher than 75-78%

Agree. My best stuff tends to be in that range. I BIAB and my start point in Beersmith is 69% BHE.
 
dan125 said:
The only thing I did different this time was to increase mash time from 80mins to 90mins before mash out.
Do you think mashing for an extra 30mins or so would have a further significant increase in efficiency?
:hmm:

When I mashout I only heat to 75C, with lots of stirring. I don't hold it there for any time. I've always thought that the stirring is the most important part to get the sugars out of the grain husks and into solution. I don't chase a high efficiency figure. I used to get about 75% but by introducing a mini sparge, which I do whilst heating the bulk to a boil, I have found a significant increase in my calculated efficiency. Beer tastes the same as before so why not do a sparge? It doesn't add any time to your brewday, since it's done before the boil is reached. It also allows me to brew 23l in a 32l pan, whereas without the sparge 20l is the biggest I could manage.
 
dan125 said:
pob said:
Tannins are extracted when temperatures are too high (its a chemical not a physical process).
:-D

I've been squeezing my bag more after reading this somewhere, but do you happen to know at what temp tannins start to be a problem? Ta

Also, I'm celebrating having just achieved 70% efficiency for the first time with BIAB #5 (been floundering at 65% up till now).
92% is the stuff of dreams!
The only thing I did different this time was to increase mash time from 80mins to 90mins before mash out.
Do you think mashing for an extra 30mins or so would have a further significant increase in efficiency?
:hmm:

I think two of the big contributing factors to my high efficiency were stirring every thirty mins and making sure my mash temp stayed at 66 degree by insulating the pot with towels and a blanket during mash and applying some more heat when it dropped by a degree or so.

I also increased my mash from 60min to 90min which I think helped loads too
 
A 90min mash gives me good conversion (mash efficiencies of ~72-78%, could get 82% with Maxi-BIAB before changing equipment). Stirring the mash at dough-in, 10 mins and then every 30 mins helps too.

My eBIAB Keggle is wrapped with 2 layers of Thermowrap & foam sleeping bag mat (remember the base & lid aswell), only drops 1~2C over 90 mins. A top up boost of heat (stirring at all time) for a couple of mins if required. (STC-1000 handy to use, I need to manually switch off, as heating approaches target, to prevent over-run on heat. PID or Arduino based controller would help this.)

Mash-out at 76C for 10 mins to finish off, then bag lifted & squeezed, left to drain in bucket and then added back into keggle as it's heating up.
(I then First Wort Hop at this stage, another can of worms there...)
 
Aleman said:
pob said:
I love the other web misapprehension of "well, BIAB isn't as efficient as real AG" :-D
I love the other web misapprehension that you need high efficiency to make great beer :D

I go out of my way to make sure that my efficiency is no higher than 75-78%

That is very interesting, and quite encouraging. With an overnight mash and MaxiBIAB (i.e. a sparge) I was getting 80-85% efficiency, the higher the OG the lower the efficiency. My beers were good but perhaps a touch thin, maybe a hint of astringent and fermented lower than I would have expected. My reading around the subject has suggested that the longer mashing and looser grist ratio may well have the result of producing a more fermentable beer with less body/mouth feel.

I've just done my 1st brew using 3 vessels and a 90 minute mash, which got me to 75% efficiency, we'll see what effect that has on the final brew in the New Year!
 
Jeltz said:
Aleman said:
pob said:
I love the other web misapprehension of "well, BIAB isn't as efficient as real AG" :-D
I love the other web misapprehension that you need high efficiency to make great beer :D

I go out of my way to make sure that my efficiency is no higher than 75-78%

That is very interesting, and quite encouraging. With an overnight mash and MaxiBIAB (i.e. a sparge) I was getting 80-85% efficiency, the higher the OG the lower the efficiency. My beers were good but perhaps a touch thin, maybe a hint of astringent and fermented lower than I would have expected. My reading around the subject has suggested that the longer mashing and looser grist ratio may well have the result of producing a more fermentable beer with less body/mouth feel.

I've just done my 1st brew using 3 vessels and a 90 minute mash, which got me to 75% efficiency, we'll see what effect that has on the final brew in the New Year!

I notice an increase in quality with 60 min mashes too. sometimes it's good to have the big conversion of an overnight mash with strong beers, but grain efficiency doesn't matter to us THAT much on a home brew level.
 
Efficiency ... well I have heard of it. :whistle:

I gave up years ago and now work on what works on my system. If I load 5.5Kg of PA then I will end up with 27L of 1050 in the FV that is what I work on. I now overnight mash and sparge using my spinning arm over 30/40 min or so.
1 Hour boil is also the norm now.
 
hairybiker said:
Efficiency ... well I have heard of it. :whistle:

I gave up years ago and now work on what works on my system. If I load 5.5Kg of PA then I will end up with 27L of 1050 in the FV that is what I work on. I now overnight mash and sparge using my spinning arm over 30/40 min or so.
1 Hour boil is also the norm now.

The way I calculate it you're getting 83.2% efficiency!
 
Duxuk said:
When I mashout I only heat to 75C, with lots of stirring. I don't hold it there for any time. I've always thought that the stirring is the most important part to get the sugars out of the grain husks and into solution. I don't chase a high efficiency figure. I used to get about 75% but by introducing a mini sparge, which I do whilst heating the bulk to a boil, I have found a significant increase in my calculated efficiency. Beer tastes the same as before so why not do a sparge? It doesn't add any time to your brewday, since it's done before the boil is reached. It also allows me to brew 23l in a 32l pan, whereas without the sparge 20l is the biggest I could manage.

Thanks Duxuk.

I tend to find that getting the temp up to mash out temp is hard work with all the grains in the bag/pot and I'm concerned that the temp isn't even throughout so I tend to be a little conservative with the heating. really should rig up a pulley so I can raise the bag out whilst heating. I'll take care not to go above 75 in future.

I do a mini sparge already. I have a 50l pot but find it still gets worryingly close to the top when mashing so I keep back 3l of water for a mini sparge and a couple for topping up the FV if neccessary. the sparge definately gets a lot of wort out of the grains. I'm happy with an efficiency of 70% (maybe 75% would be nice) but thought that 65% was a bit on the low side. It's just quite nice to see some improvement in my methods.
 
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