Genius Stout 07/10/08 update

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ni9e

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Hopefully if I finish tiling the bathroom today I will be brewing this tomorrow :pray:

3.75 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 71.4 %
1.00 kg Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 19.0 %
0.50 kg Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM) Grain 9.5 %
120.42 gm Cascade [5.50%] (60 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 76.5 IBU

Struggled to get Northern Brewer hops so tried to work IBU's in beersmith I got plenty of Cascade so I thought I'd use them are the IBU's about right for this brew?
Hope so my stock is getting dangerously low and I have been looking forward to trying this :grin:
 
First impressions are the IBU's are a tad high - what OG are you aiming for ni9e :?:
I'd multilpy the stating gravity by 1.0 maximum (my personal taste is more like 0.75) So, if it's around 1047 then 47IBU should be fine.

Not sure Cascade is the perfect hop for a stout either. Do you have anything else :?:
 
I'm after OG 1042-1045

I have Amorillo and Liberty hops also I havent used Amorillo yet but Liberty arn't suitable for stout there more an aroma hop.
 
Don't fancy doing an an American pale ale instead do you :D

Perhaps someone else could help on that front, but the calcualtion for the IBU's should get you about right, whatever hops you go for. Hope it goes well, I'm also brewing tomorrow - probably the London Pride from Graham Wheeler's book.
 
This is the original recipie


Batch Size (L): 24.00
Total Grain (kg): 5.250
Anticipated OG: 1042-1045

Brewhouse Efficiency: 75-80 % - I haven't worked it out yet
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Grain/Extract/Sugar
3.750 kg. Pale Malt - Maris Otter
1.000 kg. Flaked Barley
0.500 kg. Crushed Roast Barley

Hops
70.0g Northern Brewer Hops (60 minutes Boil)

5g Irish Moss Fining 15 Min. (boil)

Yeast
Safale 04

Beersmith gives the IBU's of 70g of Northern Brewer @ 76.5 and 76.4 for the amount of Cascade so am I wrong to try to match IBU's?
 
ni9e said:
Beersmith gives the IBU's of 70g of Northern Brewer @ 76.5 and 76.4 for the amount of Cascade so am I wrong to try to match IBU's?
If that's the recipe and, that's how you like it, then matching the IBU's is fine. Where did the original recipe come from :?:

The only reason I have queried it, is that I've done a sweet stout, hopped to 40 IBU's, and have a recipe for Beamish and a Guinness which are also hopped to 40 and 45 respectively. There is an Imperial Russian Stout in GW's book which is hopped to 70 IBU but, it's a big beer starting at 1104OG :shock:

Having looked at your recipe, I'd query the Beersmith set-up. With my equipment, 70g of Northern Brewer (8.5%AA) gives 46 IBU which looks far more reasonable.

What are the actual AA content of the hops for the original recipe and the AA content of your Cascade :?: :?:
 
That recipe looks a lot like a Guinness clone so you should be aiming at around 40IBU. Of those hop varieties I'd personally go with the Liberty as the others are too American for a dry stout. Liberty is much less assertive. If you want to do an Americanised stout then go with Amarillo for bitterness (most alpha) and then late hop with cascade.
 
Buzz said:
What are the actual AA content of the hops for the original recipe and the AA content of your Cascade :?: :?:

I don't know the actual AA of the original recipie I got it here and I made a trip to Stockport for some yeast and picked up a pack of Northdown hops 7.5%AA so I'm gonna try again on beersmith to try and see whats up with the settings.
 
Good news about the Northdown, it will be worth the effort of getting them. :thumb:

Around 70g should give you something around the 40IBU mark. Make sure you put all the ingredients into the recipe when using Beersmith, not just the hops, and you should get something similar.
 
Beersmith is giving me 65.5 IBU Ive taken a screenshot for you to see

ScreenShot00.jpg
 
What calculation are you using for Hop bitterness, Using Promash I get OG 1.052 and 57.8 IBU Using Tinseth.
 
I'm getting 56.3 IBU using promash and have changed the settings to Tinseth and changed the hops to Northdown :wha:
 
I'm getting 56.3 IBU using promash and have changed the settings to Tinseth and changed the hops to Northdown :wha:
 
:wha: :wha: :wha: Sorry Changed the settings in Promash for Tinseth to better resemble what I get from my system :oops: . . . Looks like more reasonable figures from yours though.

I've just run it through GW's Beer engine and it comes out as 1.057 /61 (OG/IBU) SO they all appear to be coming out in the same ballpark . . . I'd say a tadd over bitter for Guiness . . . IN fact a tad strong for it as well ;)

:oops: In the beer engine when I've adjusted it for 23L not 20L it comes out as 49/57, so not that strong, but certainly a higher bittering
 
Looking at Buzz's Screen shot the Efficiency is 60%, and looking at the IBU I would guess that he is using a base utilisation of 20% for hops. When I plug those into The Beer Engine I get 1.039 / 35 IBU Which is much better, but may not match what you get out of your system (I know for a fact I get a much higher utilisation than 20% . . . GW estimates that most home brewers are getting close to 27% . . . the new book will reflect that)
 
I can't remember what changes I made to Beersmith when I started using it. I know it hits the OG on the nose every time I brew. I've never worked out the IBU's manually before - perhaps my beers are hoppier than BS is saying :?:
 
Buzz said:
perhaps my beers are hoppier than BS is saying :?:

You never can really tell unless you compare with a beer of known IBU . . . Or send a sample away to Brewlab with a check for 20 quid to find out for sure . . . . I had the gas system 'profiled' and know that Promash (Tinseth ) overestimates my IBU, by around 15-20% . . . So I have to remember to up the hops if I go back tot he default settings . . . which I keep doing :twisted:
 
ni9e, I think I know why my values are so low. I put in all the details of my brewgear when I set it up (tools/options/brewing tab). When I look now at the 'details' on brewing eqpt, my 'hops utilisation factor' shows 80%. Reading the Beersmith help, it suggests the default is 100% for batches below 20 gallons.

If I change this value to 100%, close the program, open it again and try the new recipe, the IBU's go up. Not sure why this option was adjusted but it may explain why our figures differ. It gave me a 54 IBU this time.

Sooo complicated eh? I'm going to leave mine as it is, as I I've got used to the values and the beer it produces. Sorry If I've mislead you :oops: I think the upshot is, you need to hit around 40IBU for this recipe, based on your setup.
 
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