Crystal Malt

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Many forum members use 'Crystal Malt' in anything from a simple steep to boost a kit to a measured incorporation into an AG brew.
I have been using Crystal Malt at EBC140 for some time and had noticed a cloying sweetness when used in significant quantity (but no more than about 150g in a 20odd litre brew) so was experimenting how to eliminate this taste. Then I tried some Crystal Malt at EBC82, which is a lighter malt, and the cloying taste has gone or certainly reduced significantly, and the final result seems quite different between the two, and much more what I am looking for
I found this on tinterweb (copied with acknowledgment to Beersmith.com) which was very useful in understanding the situation better. (use this to change the units used https://www.brewtoad.com/tools/color-converter)

Using Caramel Malts in Beer

Before we go into each caramel malt, you need to know that Caramel and Crystal malts have no diastatic power, so they are to be used as an adjunct and never a base malt. Also many of the sugars in the malt caramelize during roasting, and become unfermentable which is why caramel malt adds sweetness and body to the finished beer. Carmel/Crystal malts also improve the head retention of a finished beer. Those kilned at higher temperature generally have a stronger caramel flavor. Generally caramel makes up 2-15% of the grist, but in some cases may be slightly higher.
Avoiding Overuse of Caramel Malts in Beer

There is a strong tendency, especially with beginning brewers, to overuse and even abuse caramel malts by simply using too much. Caramel malts should properly be used for their body and flavor and some color where appropriate, and should be used in small quantities. Rarely should the total caramel malt exceed 10% of the grain bill, and 5% is probably a better target. Don’t add a rainbow of caramel malts �" select the one you need and use it. Also, use the darker caramel malts sparingly �" as the color approaches 100 SRM, these malts get increasingly astringent, and have a more burnt flavor, which can often destroy the flavor balance in your beer. Moderation is the key.
Carapils, Carafoam, Dextrine Malts: At the low end of the scale we have Carapils, Dextrine malt, Carafoam which are roughly equivalent (note some of these are brand names) with a color of around 1.5-3 L. These are the lightest caramel malts, made from light pilsner malt and roasted slowly at very low temperature. They do not have strong caramel overtones, and very little color so these are primarily used to add body and head retention to the finished beer.
Light Caramel Malts (10-30 L): These malts impart a light honey-like sweetness as well as body to the finished beer. They also add some color to the finished beer, usually a light straw color if used alone. They are not as sweet or caramel flavored as the darker variations.
Medium Caramel/Crystal (40L-60 L): These are the most commonly used caramel and crystal malts. They impart a measurable sweetness and caramel flavor to the finished beer, which you can taste even by sampling the raw malt. These are well suited for many English and American style milds, porters, stouts and bitters. They also add significant body and head retention to the finished beer.
Dark Caramel/Crystal (70-90 L): These malts add a much darker color as well as caramel flavor. Due to the high roasting level, some bitterness is also added, creating a bitter-sweet finish. The finished color can show hints of reddish tint, depending on the level of malt used. These also add body and head retention and are used most often in darker beers such as Porters and Stouts.
Very Dark Caramel/Crystal Malts (100-220 L): These include not only dark Caramel malts such as Caramel 120, but also custom specialty malts like Carafa I, Carafa II, and Special B (which is very dark at 220 L). These malts add not only significant color and caramel flavors, but also often include a bitter, nutty somewhat roasted flavor. They should be used sparingly (1/8-1/2 pound max per 5 gal/19L), as the bitterness can easily overwhelm a beer. Large amounts can lead to a bitter, plum like flavor. Some variations such as Weyermann’s Carafa are dehusked to reduce the bitter off flavor.

So the purpose of the post is to ask other forum members are they really picky when it comes to buying and using crystal malt, given that some of the Graham Wheeler book recipes call for over 400g 'Crystal Malt' on many bitters, let alone stouts and other dark beers.
 
Geberally stick to the light /medium end of the spectrum so far even in a stout.. maybe I should try a darker one but I dont tend to brew Big beers or robust types often.

Will be interested to see what others think also
 
Thats a good beginners guide Terry. Where GH specifies Crystal Malt, he never states the EBC rating, which seems a bit daft.
 
I have used strong Belgian crystal malt (120 EBC) ... didn't like it at all, overpowering burnt sugar cum fig & fruit flavours. I stick to the lighter crystals, still limited to Belgian, and get honey like flavours, much more pleasant.
 
Thats a good beginners guide Terry. Where GH specifies Crystal Malt, he never states the EBC rating, which seems a bit daft.

To be fair to the man, during his extensive pre-ambling chapters, there is included on page 10 an explanation that there are Light (50-70 EBC), Standard (130-170) and Dark (200-400) Crystal malts and that his his recipes refer to Standard unless specified otherwise.

Apologies for being such a nerd.:lol:
 
What's the difference between 'L' and 'EBC' then? In the GH book, if a standard is 130-170EBC, how many L is it?

Just trying to relate to the post above...
 
What's the difference between 'L' and 'EBC' then? In the GH book, if a standard is 130-170EBC, how many L is it?

Just trying to relate to the post above...

Very roughly, divide EBC by 2 to get the L
 
Great read.
I'm one have fall foul n not working out what the crystals and carapils for...
Hence the waiting out how my lager comes out...might be ok with the crystal...but 300g of carapils in a 23l batch might ruin it!!!! Time will tell...and now I research til the cows come home...live n learn eh?
 
To be fair to the man, during his extensive pre-ambling chapters, there is included on page 10 an explanation that there are Light (50-70 EBC), Standard (130-170) and Dark (200-400) Crystal malts and that his his recipes refer to Standard unless specified otherwise.

Apologies for being such a nerd.:lol:
Thanks,I'll have a look more carefully, though I have the first edition, which is I believe slightly different.
 
To be fair to the man, during his extensive pre-ambling chapters, there is included on page 10 an explanation that there are Light (50-70 EBC), Standard (130-170) and Dark (200-400) Crystal malts and that his his recipes refer to Standard unless specified otherwise.

Apologies for being such a nerd.:lol:

Hmm, I just had a look for this and it doesn't appear to be in my version of the GH book...

I bought it fairly recently but it must be an old copy.
 
Rarely should the total caramel malt exceed 10% of the grain bill, and 5% is probably a better target.

Hi!
In GWs book, page 26 in my edition, it suggests 20% max. of Crystal Malt. I wonder why there is such a difference of opinion?

So the purpose of the post is to ask other forum members are they really picky when it comes to buying and using crystal malt, given that some of the Graham Wheeler book recipes call for over 400g 'Crystal Malt' on many bitters, let alone stouts and other dark beers.

I am planning a Milk Stout using GWs recipe, but now I'm going to look at other recipes online to compare the amount of crystal malts - GWs recipe uses 15% in total of chocolate, crystal and Special-B malts.
 
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