Robots.

According to an "expert" on the radio this morning In 20 to 40 years most of us will not be working he said they have already replaced 800,000 jobs, if we are not working what will we do and how do we pay the bills?

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Building robots

If you turned off the benefits tap for two weeks, many cities in this country would descend into anarchy.
When it comes to large urban areas, we are now for the most part just groups of disparate peoples, living along side each other.
I think we need to stop the large movement of people entering Europe and think of another way of funding peoples retirement because it is basically a ponzi scheme where we have to constantly import masses of people who will need even more people imported to fund their pensions later on.
Even that won't work because there will be no jobs so we will just have a massive population that will need to have benefits provided for.
People have no idea how fragile society is, if the pound crashed we would be in very serious trouble, very quickly.

Saisonator said:

If you turned off the benefits tap for two weeks, many cities in this country would descend into anarchy.
When it comes to large urban areas, we are now for the most part just groups of disparate peoples, living along side each other.
I think we need to stop the large movement of people entering Europe and think of another way of funding peoples retirement because it is basically a ponzi scheme where we have to constantly import masses of people who will need even more people imported to fund their pensions later on.
Even that won't work because there will be no jobs so we will just have a massive population that will need to have benefits provided for.
People have no idea how fragile society is, if the pound crashed we would be in very serious trouble, very quickly.

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There's quite a few variants on this 'quote' but they do say, "civilisation is only two meals from anarchy"

Chippy_Tea said:

According to an "expert" on the radio this morning In 20 to 40 years most of us will not be working he said they have already replaced 800,000 jobs, if we are not working what will we do and how do we pay the bills?

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I can remember being told the same sort of thing at college in 1965. I'm still working 52 years later.

MyQul said:

There's quite a few variants on this 'quote' but they do say, "civilisation is only two meals from anarchy"

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Two meals? If I eat breakfast an hour late I'm ready to start a revolution!


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Hi!
I used to live in a council maisonette in Dagenham - it had all-electric heating because, when it was built, nuclear power would provide free electricity for everyone. So much for predicting the future!

Chippy_Tea said:

According to an "expert" on the radio this morning In 20 to 40 years most of us will not be working he said they have already replaced 800,000 jobs, if we are not working what will we do and how do we pay the bills?

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Not much different to 'now', then. Days will be spent watching Jeremy Kyle and living off McDonalds and KFCs paid for by those who are working ( at McDonalds and KFC).

There won't be any human burger flippers at McDonald's they will be the ones loading the conveyor belts.

Saisonator said:

I think we need to stop the large movement of people entering Europe and think of another way of funding peoples retirement because it is basically a ponzi scheme where we have to constantly import masses of people who will need even more people imported to fund their pensions later on.
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I agree that we need more egalitarian pension system. This would eliminate the unfair and dangerously unstable pyramid scheme that we have in certain institutions where a chunk of everyone's wages / taxes goes to pay the pensions of people who retired decades ago.

There should be a single pension system for everyone, based on investment during working life, with a fixed, fair employer's contribution for everyone. That way shop workers, politicians, lorry drivers, nurses and self employed window cleaners would all have the same pension options. It would also stop all the moaning and strikes blamed on changes to pension systems.

Gunge said:

Not much different to 'now', then. Days will be spent watching Jeremy Kyle and living off McDonalds and KFCs paid for by those who are working ( at McDonalds and KFC).

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A robot Jeremy Kyle, I might actually watch that. COuld they do a paternity test on a robot though?

Chippy_Tea said:

According to an "expert" on the radio this morning In 20 to 40 years most of us will not be working he said they have already replaced 800,000 jobs, if we are not working what will we do and how do we pay the bills?

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The rich will get richer and more powerful, and the workers will get poorer and will eventually become irrelevant.

In the past, automation has created jobs as well as replaced them, but as we head towards the 'singularity', technology is becoming so advanced that more and more jobs can be replaced.

It is happening. Maybe not as fast as some have suggested. But it ill happen.

Eventually the rich will be able to isolate themselves from labour, and generate capital without needing workers. No wage and no threat of strike action makes the workforce irrelevant.

What happens to the ex-workers grumbling at the factory gates and getting restless? Maybe the rich will decide to redistribute their wealth, and will be happy to pay for the workers to do nothing. Or maybe someone will decide that they are a nuisance and that the world would be more profitable without them.

Sorry, that is grim picture isn't it.
I have been reading 'Four Futures' by Peter Frase - it is terrifying.
Let's not worry though, the experts may be wrong.

MagnusTS said:

The rich will get richer and more powerful, and the workers will get poorer and will eventually become irrelevant.

In the past, automation has created jobs as well as replaced them, but as we head towards the 'singularity', technology is becoming so advanced that more and more jobs can be replaced.

It is happening. Maybe not as fast as some have suggested. But it ill happen.

Eventually the rich will be able to isolate themselves from labour, and generate capital without needing workers. No wage and no threat of strike action makes the workforce irrelevant.

What happens to the ex-workers grumbling at the factory gates and getting restless? Maybe the rich will decide to redistribute their wealth, and will be happy to pay for the workers to do nothing. Or maybe someone will decide that they are a nuisance and that the world would be more profitable without them.

Sorry, that is grim picture isn't it.
I have been reading 'Four Futures' by Peter Frase - it is terrifying.
Let's not worry though, the experts may be wrong.

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and if there are no consumers to buy stuff because they dont have an income?

There is also the gene roddenberry view of humanity & technology which is more optimistic and the global liberal? elite looking towards one world government. It could turn out like the star trek founders vision although a lot of people have suffered in the attempt to get to that stage. EU & USA elites have ignored this fact and thats why trump got the job.

population control with robots looking after the elderly. continuous growth and consumption is eating the planet.

dad_of_jon said:

and if there are no consumers to buy stuff because they dont have an income?

There is also the gene roddenberry view of humanity & technology which is more optimistic and the global liberal? elite looking towards one world government. It could turn out like the star trek founders vision although a lot of people have suffered in the attempt to get to that stage. EU & USA elites have ignored this fact and thats why trump got the job.

population control with robots looking after the elderly. continuous growth and consumption is eating the planet.

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Yes, I like your future better than the one I painted. :)

Governments and businesses need to accept now that this is going to happen and plan for it. Businesses need to accept that they will need the populus to have income from somewhere. The government need to accept that employment and taxing the working class is not sustainable as there are and will be fewer and fewer jobs. The fact that people spend more time working than they do living a healthy lifestyle (time to be outdoors, exercise, prepare healthy good etc) is actually terrible. Education needs to be focused on instilling people with a passion in life whether that is art, science, engineering etc so that people have a desire to work rather than have to work to survive. The fact that people have been convinced they have a moral obligation to work must have come from centuries of brain washing from upper class/the rich. Take a single human being and they should be able to survive on their own, build their own home, and find food. The idea of earning money to survive is a cultural thing that we will have to move away from.

This isn't to suggest I support the fact that people are too lazy to contribute, however I am pretty sure that there are rich people who have a similar outlook on life but they can get away with it because they have money.

According to the Telegraph last Saturday, Robots will be doing much more than just taking our jobs...

The prediction in my OP was 20 - 40 years it looks like there is a good chance i will not have to worry too much about it, i hope the robots in the care home take it easy with the Andrex when my farmer Giles are playing up. :wink:



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Chippy_Tea said:

There won't be any human burger flippers at McDonald's they will be the ones loading the conveyor belts.

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feeding us chopped up humans aka soylent green. :mrgreen:

BeerCat said:

feeding us chopped up humans aka soylent green. :mrgreen:

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No comment, lest I find myself on the wrong end of a lawsuit. But, many a true word is spoken in jest.

AI and Artificial Super Intelligence (ASI) is an interest of mine and it's quite funny when people say "robots will take all jobs!" As someone else said here, they've been saying that 50+ years.

If you want to get a better idea at what ASI and "automation" means I'd strongly recommend reading this two part article https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-1.html. It's long but a very gripping read.