If we were chatting in a bar...

..here's what I'd ask. None of these worth a thread of their own, but all add up.

- What's yours? :hat:
- Is a wooden spoon OK for a mash?
- Do you need Iodine if you mash for 1h15min? Is it just about time saving?
- Is it worthwhile getting a pH meter? If so, at what price level do they start to become viable?
- I hear that hops lose 40% of AA in 6 months. 6 months is not long. Is it worthwhile factoring sliding loss into my calculations, even if I refrigerate?
- My head retention is poor. I thought AG would sort this out, but no. So what grain is best to add, with minimum flavour and clarity impact. Is it addition or replacement, and what percentage?

Mine's a Chouffe double IPA tripple. Cheers.

Fore said:

..here's what I'd ask. None of these worth a thread of their own, but all add up.

- What's yours? :hat: I'll have a look at what's on.
- Is a wooden spoon OK for a mash? Yes
- Do you need Iodine if you mash for 1h15min? Is it just about time saving? I don't bother, and I mash for an hour. Tops.
- Is it worthwhile getting a pH meter? If so, at what price level do they start to become viable? I don't bother.
- I hear that hops lose 40% of AA in 6 months. 6 months is not long. Is it worthwhile factoring sliding loss into my calculations, even if I refrigerate? Not all hops lose AA at the same rate. I do use an online calculator sometimes to calculate the AA loss of bittering hops.
- My head retention is poor. I thought AG would sort this out, but no. So what grain is best to add, with minimum flavour and clarity impact. Is it addition or replacement, and what percentage? My AG beers don't suffer from poor head retention. Malted or Torrified wheat are good, 3-5%. But I get good head without them...

Mine's a Chouffe double IPA tripple. Cheers.

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I've answered honestly...

Fore said:

..here's what I'd ask. None of these worth a thread of their own, but all add up.

- What's yours? :hat:
- Is a wooden spoon OK for a mash?
- Do you need Iodine if you mash for 1h15min? Is it just about time saving?
- Is it worthwhile getting a pH meter? If so, at what price level do they start to become viable?
- I hear that hops lose 40% of AA in 6 months. 6 months is not long. Is it worthwhile factoring sliding loss into my calculations, even if I refrigerate?
- My head retention is poor. I thought AG would sort this out, but no. So what grain is best to add, with minimum flavour and clarity impact. Is it addition or replacement, and what percentage?

Mine's a Chouffe double IPA tripple. Cheers.

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Mines a dry Stout.
Wooden spoon/stick is what was used in early days which is what carried the yeast strain so not advisable unless you get all solid matter out of the grain and then sterilise before next use.
I wouldn't use iodine. It tests for starch that has not been converted to sugars. A hydrometer will tell you if sugar has got to expected values.
If you use tap water you can get the ph value from your water company and work out changes with what you add.
I can't remember the rest of the bar chat (too many beers)

- What's yours? :hat:

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What's on?

- Is a wooden spoon OK for a mash?

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For a mash, yes. The wort will be boiled afterwards. Wouldn't use one in fermenting beer though.

- Do you need Iodine if you mash for 1h15min? Is it just about time saving?

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I tried using Iodine some years ago, it didn't really tell me anything since no matter how long I waited there was always some starch left in the grain. Even if there wasn't, how would you know what the balance of sugars in the mash was?

- Is it worthwhile getting a pH meter? If so, at what price level do they start to become viable?

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I don't have but am considering getting one. I found this when I researched...
http://www.braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=PH_Meter_Buying_Guide

- I hear that hops lose 40% of AA in 6 months. 6 months is not long. Is it worthwhile factoring sliding loss into my calculations, even if I refrigerate?

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Freeze them in a bag with as much air as possible squeezed out. Clibit's advice is good.

- My head retention is poor. I thought AG would sort this out, but no. So what grain is best to add, with minimum flavour and clarity impact. Is it addition or replacement, and what percentage?

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I use Torrified wheat in all my beers. 5-10%, based mainly on whim.

Mine's a Chouffe double IPA tripple. Cheers.

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Get another for me while you're buying it? thanks! :drink:

What's on? Heineken & bud light. Sorry; perhaps we should have stayed at mine.

Others can't quite agree on the mash paddle either. But I'll take the decision on the majority rule… wooden mash paddle it is.

Iodine; forget that then.

pH meter? Maybe a crimbo pressi if I can't think of anything else.

Found an on-line calculator for AA% loss. Quite detailed in the questions, hop, storage conditions & temperature etc. Worth using I think. I presume the "age" is after opening? And there doesn't seem to be an option for leaf vs pellet. I would have thought leaf would deteriorate faster, no? The calculator has me thinking I should freeze and not refrigerate.

I don't find Torrified wheat on the site of my supplier. Nearest I can find is wheat flakes. Is this interchangeable? Maybe I'm missing something; might it be called something other than "torrified"? Will this add sugar, i.e. is it a substitute and not an addition?

Come on guys, definitely your round.

Too complex. I do home brew to get cheap beer. I want cheap beer with minimum of work. All this boiling is too much work for what I get so keeping is simple it's a tin of concentrate which does not get taxed to hilt so works out at around 20p per pint. It's mix ingredients and place in fridge, transfer to clean fermentor to remove sediment the bottle in 2 litre bottles then transfer to shed for 9 months. So today drinking beer started 7th Jan 2015 tastes good and is cheap.

I realise some want total control and brew from scratch, start with grain and let it start to grow the malting process and this is a labour of love. I realise these beers will taste better than mine and I'll take my hat off to those would brew from scratch. To brew from scratch you need space. First is the field to grow the grain, then the floor to malt the grain, then the boiling cooling and adding of hops, and other additives. Now come the selecting of the yeast that tradition was retained on the wooden stirring stick. But this means boiling and unless boiled speed is essential so with kit beer we use tap water and start with far more yeast than traditionally used.

To my mind it's all or northing, either start with grain and go though the whole process, or use the short cut and use a concentrate. With the concentrate you are using tap water loads of yeast and a temperature high enough to ensure alcohol is produced quickly before any natural yeast has a chance to take over. With traditional your using boiled water and the yeast strain retained on the stirring stick. There is no half way.

I would want a 10p pint if I put all that work into it.

With regards to head retention look at your glassware (including bottles if you bottle) try to use minimal washing up liquid if poss, you can use some but make sure you are thorough when rinsing.. Avoid using dishwashers aswell, I think the rinse aid can be a head killer

You can use wheat malt or flaked wheat instead of terrified wheat, they all need mashing. You can use a wooden spoon in the mash but not in the FV.

ericmark said:

To my mind it's all or northing, either start with grain and go though the whole process, or use the short cut and use a concentrate.

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If you define "all" as starting by growing your own grain, then wouldn't the definition of "nothing" be a trip to the supermarket?

This is a spectrum of activity and you can choose your entry point depending on your motivation. Even Braumeister is all grain, but is rejected by some as they feel it makes things too easy. Maybe 20 years ago my motivation was about obtaining cheap beer. Now though, it's an interest, a hobby, so I'm happy with the process, as it is that challenge which holds my interest. Motivations can differ from one person to the next.

I also cook my own Indian, Chinese & Thai food, albeit I could pop to the local take-away. And I'm not going to rear a lamb or grow coconut plants.

Covrich said:

With regards to head retention look at your glassware (including bottles if you bottle) try to use minimal washing up liquid if poss, you can use some but make sure you are thorough when rinsing.. Avoid using dishwashers aswell, I think the rinse aid can be a head killer

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Already thought of that. No help I'm afraid. I can hear the head popping the moment I pour the beer. I've always had the same problem with kits and assumed that AG would resolve it. It still might to be honest; I'm only drinking AG#1 and it was a low temp mash, so quite watery. Maybe other beers will turn out very different.

Once I tried gelatine. Didn't do anything other than give the beer a strange mouth feel. Here's hoping wheat will finally crack this.

clibit said:

You can use wheat malt or flaked wheat instead of terrified wheat, they all need mashing.

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Thanks, clearer now. Surprised I can't find terrified; maybe it's hiding.

My only input is I did a stout kit and had brew sugar and misjudged the water so it was at 22 litres at OG. The Stout is thin with no head even after nearly 2 month in bottles.
Another stout kit exactly the same except I used DME and treacle and volume was at 21 litres and the body, taste and head are great and that's before bottling and priming so It could be volume of water, using DME (most likely) or both that increased body and head.

Fore said:

Thanks, clearer now. Surprised I can't find terrified; maybe it's hiding.

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http://www.geterbrewed.com/torrified-wheat/
http://www.thehomebrewcompany.co.uk/torrified-wheat-crushed-500g-p-242.html
http://www.themaltmiller.co.uk/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=39

Torrified wheat is puffed wheat. It's not malted but the enzymes already present in the mash will convert the starch in it into sugars so it will add to the gravity of the beer. The fact that it's puffed rather than powdery is supposed to help stop the mash clogging up.

You could use sugar puffs. Various types of sugar from one box. :thumb: :smile:

clibit said:

You could use sugar puffs. Various types of sugar from one box. :thumb: :smile:

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Sugar puffs! That I think I can get. I only need a few hundred grams.

My option are limited in France; not much interest in homebrew here. Then I discover there is a micro brewery round the corner. Think I'll make myself known. Only good things can come of it.

Fore said:

Sugar puffs! That I think I can get. I only need a few hundred grams.

My option are limited in France; not much interest in homebrew here. Then I discover there is a micro brewery round the corner. Think I'll make myself known. Only good things can come of it.

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Got to be done. I have a vision of you knocking on the door, carrying a plastic bucket "Could I borrow some torrified wheat please?".

Not possible to buy on-line?

HebridesRob said:

Got to be done. I have a vision of you knocking on the door, carrying a plastic bucket "Could I borrow some torrified wheat please?".

Not possible to buy on-line?

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And the reply... "Désolé, je ne comprends pas". :|

Delivery charges are extortionate over here. My supplier delivers personally to my door in the evening for free, on the way to the micro-brewery round the corner (hence how I discovered it exists). He is a distributer of a well known on-line homebrew resource in any case, Brouwland. They just don't seem to have torrified available.

Most forms of wheat would work. I've heard of people putting shredded wheat and Weetabix in the mash.

clibit said:

Most forms of wheat would work. I've heard of people putting shredded wheat and Weetabix in the mash.

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What about Lucky Charms :sick:

clibit said:

Most forms of wheat would work. I've heard of people putting shredded wheat and Weetabix in the mash.

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Would have thought malted wheat would be readily available in France.

Plain flour would work, just wouldn't want to overdo it and end up with a set mash. Some suppliers have empty grain husks that could be used to offset the stickiness caused by the flour. Could just get wheat and crush it roughly, or even malt it.