Beginners Guide to Water Treatment (plus links to more advanced water treatment in post #1)

Ok, well it doesn't look too bad then, though personally I'd probably add a touch more calcium chloride to increase the calcium to about 100ppm or so.

svenito said:

There are no acid additions yet, as I plan to add that once I kno mash pH

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What do you mean by this? Are you saying you're going to check the mash pH and then add the acid?

strange-steve said:

Yeah your water report is as good as useless. Really, unless you know what's in your water you're flying blind. Either contact your water company to see if they can give you alkalinity and calcium figures, or better yet, get the Salifert kits and test for yourself. Judging by the other values in your report, it looks to be fairly low in minerals which is good for building your own profiles.

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Hi Steve i have the kits you mentioned and use them with every brew its just that i don't know how to enter the results into brunwater. I suppose what i am after is someone who uses brunwater is to give me a idiots guide on how to do this hopefully

strange-steve said:

Ok, well it doesn't look too bad then, though personally I'd probably add a touch more calcium chloride to increase the calcium to about 100ppm or so.

What do you mean by this? Are you saying you're going to check the mash pH and then add the acid?

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Ca to 100pm? Sounds like a plan. Thanks

Yes, that's what I mean. Is this not the way to go?

private4587 said:

Hi Steve i have the kits you mentioned and use them with every brew its just that i don't know how to enter the results into brunwater. I suppose what i am after is someone who uses brunwater is to give me a idiots guide on how to do this hopefully

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Ah ok, well then you should have most of the needed info for Bru'n Water.

On the water input page, enter the following values:
Calcium (known from the Salifert kit)
Magnesium - 5 (only an estimate)
Sodium - 6.5
Sulphate - 48
Chloride - 11
Nitrate - 2.5
In the box labeled "Reported total alkalinity" enter the alkalinity value from the Salifert test.
In the pH box next to that one enter 7.7
It will then tell you the estimated bicarbonate concentration which you can enter in the bicarbonate box at the top.
Leave all the others at 0

On the next page "sparge acidification" enter the alkalinity and pH again, set "target pH" to 5.5, and "volume" to 1L.

That's all your values entered. Now to dilute with RO water, go to the "water adjustment" page and in the cell below "dilution water profile" select distilled water* from the drop down menu. Then for 50/50 tap water to RO adjust the dilution percentage to 50.

The diluted water profile will now be shown.

Hope that helps. Btw what are your average alkalinity and calcium values out of interest?

*If you're wondering why to choose distilled water rather than RO, it's because the RO profile in Bru'n Water is from a hard water source whereas yours seems to be pretty soft like mine, so your RO water will be closer to distilled.

svenito said:

Yes, that's what I mean. Is this not the way to go?

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No that's not a good way to do it. Adjust the water's alkalinity to the correct range before doughing-in and the mash pH should fall into the correct range without having to adjust it mid-mash.
I had a little play around with your profile on that water calculator, have a look at it now to see what you think:
https://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemistry-and-brewing-water-calculator/?id=SKF6VK6
Basically what I've done is, for the mash I've blended your tap water 50/50 with Ashbeck and added a little gypsum, calcium chloride and phosphoric acid to reduce the alkalinity to 20ppm.
Then the sparge water is 100% Ashbeck with some calcium chloride and a touch of acid to reduce the pH to 5.4.
That gives a good finished profile and an estimated mash pH of 5.46.

Wow, thanks so much Steve. Really appreciate it! Seems ok to me, and should be interested to see what effect it has. Plan to do some iterations of the same recipe, and one will be without water adjustment, to see how much difference I can detect.

This is perfect. Judging from what I struggled with, I need to figure out what target values to aim for. I understand the RA targets etc, but not so much targets for the other minerals. Time to study!

svenito said:

I need to figure out what target values to aim for. I understand the RA targets etc, but not so much targets for the other minerals. Time to study!

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What you'll probably find from a bit of online research is that there is an Atlantic divide regarding "ideal" mineral levels. In the US low mineral content is generally advocated, whereas in the UK most tend to prefer a comparatively high content (specifically calcium, sulphate and chloride). At the end of the day, it's simply down to personal taste. We brew for ourselves (mostly) so if what you're doing works for you then great, though a bit of trial and error is required. One thing I will recommend though, is to ignore RA. It's really not terribly helpful and serves mostly to just confuse people. If you stick to the recommended alkalinity as CaCO3 levels you should be fine.

Hi Steve hope you don't think i am being a pest but could you have a look at my Bro n Water profile for a SamAdams Ocktoberfest clone. My average values are Alkilinity 43 Calcium 40

private4587 said:

Hi Steve hope you don't think i am being a pest but could you have a look at my Bro n Water profile for a SamAdams Ocktoberfest clone. My average values are Alkilinity 43 Calcium 40

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I'm away from the computer atm so can't open your file, but for an oktoberfest you'll need only very minor water treatment with your profile. A little calcium chloride to increase the calcium is really all I'd do, about 0.2g/L should do it.

Thanks very much steve, that is what Bru n Water states along with .42ml of lattice acid in the sparge water

I ve just been looking at the water report for my area...
Calcium carbonate..80
Sodium. .8.56
Sulphate...67.5
Nitrate...3.3
Chloride...11.1
No magnesium or akalinity given.
This is an online report done around a year ago..should I go with it or do my own tests?

Cheers

Clint

Clint said:

I ve just been looking at the water report for my area...
Calcium carbonate..80
Sodium. .8.56
Sulphate...67.5
Nitrate...3.3
Chloride...11.1
No magnesium or akalinity given.
This is an online report done around a year ago..should I go with it or do my own tests?

Cheers

Clint

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Nah that's not really any use, it doesn't have the two most important values, calcium and alkalinity. Better to test for yourself.

Ok thanks. .

Hi Steve about to embark on a Sam Adams Ocktoberfest clone and using 100% RO water Bru n Water report says i need to add some magnesium, I guess this would be in the form of Epson Salts is this OK?

private4587 said:

Hi Steve about to embark on a Sam Adams Ocktoberfest clone and using 100% RO water Bru n Water report says i need to add some magnesium, I guess this would be in the form of Epson Salts is this OK?

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Yep, though I would maybe go 90% RO at most to make sure there are at least some of the other trace minerals in there.

Hi all,

I've been going on the basis of around 100ppm calcium for my pale ales , usually provided at a ratio of 80% gypsum to 20% calcium chloride, but I've seen a few articles online stating a min of 180ppm calcium for pale ales?

Is this an american thing where they expect a more minerally beer or have I been under seasoning my pales?

Cheers!

cheeseyfeet said:

Hi all,

I've been going on the basis of around 100ppm calcium for my pale ales , usually provided at a ratio of 80% gypsum to 20% calcium chloride, but I've seen a few articles online stating a min of 180ppm calcium for pale ales?

Is this an american thing where they expect a more minerally beer or have I been under seasoning my pales?

Cheers!

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No, generally in the US they prefer a less mineralised water profile, that sounds much more British. I normally aim for somewhere between 80 and 120 ppm calcium, whatever gives me the sulphate/chloride levels I want.

Cheers Steve, I may just stick to 120 then, I don't want a salty tasting ale!

Just looking at my water supply report from Thames Water, and it doesn't contain a separate figures for Calcium or Carbonate. I only have the combined CaCO3 figure of 141ppm. Is there any way to extrapolate from this or other figures to have an idea of whether I need to add Gypsum?

I'm not planning on brewing anything specific at the moment but having looked at the water report as a matter of curiosity and plugged the figures into the calculator, that was the glaring omission in the data.

Still pretty much a brewing novice and haven't really got into the world of water treatment but I have a H.M.A filter which I use for treating water for my aquarium. Is there any reason why I shouldn't use this to treat my brewing water?