Youngs APA tastes like Poison

Wolfracer · Dec 13, 2014

Seriously. I had to spit it out. The mrs then tried a tiny sip and did the same.
It didn't clear in the Fv, nor in the warm bottle, nor in the cold, so I thought I'd try a bottle.

I've never drank ANYTHING, and i do mean ANYTHING quite so revolting.

If I wanted to poison someone I'd give them this stuff.

Acrid, acidic, off, nasty nasty stuff, with little fizz.

I've never had a bad bew, so can't compare it to anytihng else. What went wrong?

Its not even "nearly" drinkable, its properly rank.

Do you get how bad this Stuff is?!?!

Any suggestions are welcomed!

PS will try another bottle before I bin it all. just in case it was one bad bottle, but the whole batch hasn't cleared so I assume its all the same.

BruinTuns · Dec 13, 2014

Not experienced anything like that myself (fingers crossed!) but it sounds a bit like something forum member Robert_ experienced with a Bad Cat Imperial Red kit http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=49645
He sent a sample to Bulldog Brews and apparently the cause turned out to be a yeast infection.

Yeastmaster · Dec 13, 2014

I'm sorry for your loss, wolfracer. :-(

MyQul · Dec 13, 2014

Possibly infected brew

Wolfracer · Dec 14, 2014

MyQul said:
Possibly infected brew

Infected with what though?! Bleach, dead rats?

This stuff is vile.

For comparison, I sterilised 2 FV at the same time, put the lids on, then put IPA into one and APA into the other.

The only differences were what came out of the kit, and the Hops...

Do you reckon its worth contacting Youngs or just chuck it and move on?

MyQul · Dec 14, 2014

Bacteria? Wild yeast? could be a number of things.

You say the only difference was hops, did you dry hop the horrible one?

BruinTuns · Dec 14, 2014

I'd definitely contact them. I mean, if you had a similar experience with a tin of beans you'd contact Heinz..
They may/not want a sample to test, but those kits ain't cheap and I certainly wouldn't just say bye bye to 25 quid.

Wolfracer · Dec 15, 2014

MyQul said:
Bacteria? Wild yeast? could be a number of things.

You say the only difference was hops, did you dry hop the horrible one?

Yes both had their respective youngs hops added. Both at the same time.

Thinking back though, the apa was murkey at this point though, compared to the clearer ipa.

Will contact them and see what happens. Opened another bottle today just to check and even the slightest drop on the tongue was enough to taste it was off in a big way again.

MyQul · Dec 15, 2014

Wolfracer said:
Yes both had their respective youngs hops added. Both at the same time.

Thinking back though, the apa was murkey at this point though, compared to the clearer ipa.

Will contact them and see what happens. Opened another bottle today just to check and even the slightest drop on the tongue was enough to taste it was off in a big way again.

Dry hopping was probably it then. Hops are naturally anti-bacterial but It's still a risk chucking anything that's unsanitized into your beer

chrispurvis · Dec 16, 2014

Please let us know how you get on when you contact youngs.
I done a brewferm pilsner which tastes similar to how you described your brew.
i brewed at the same time as two other brews which turned out great. So im adament its not my cleaning/steralising technique.

Cheers
chris

Wolfracer · Dec 18, 2014

Email sent to Youngs.
Will await their response with interest...and of course let you guys know in due course!

BruinTuns · Dec 18, 2014

:thumb:
Apart from anything else it will be interesting to see how their CS deal with this type of issue and whether they offer a refund.
Good luck.

brewpirate · Dec 19, 2014

Sounds like you got an infection. If you are using plastic you have a decision to come to and will have to really really clean everything good with a good cleaner and hot water and possible bleach to make sure you kill whatever you got. Does your FV have any scratchs?

- Was there any film on top of the FV before you bottled or did you notice any film in the bottles?

- How do you clean your FV, what products and any rags/scour pads/etc?

- Can you explain your brewing process and how you ferment?

- Was the seal not on the FV properly or any gaps?

- What came in contact with the beer after you chilled?

- How did you pitch the yeast? Did you dip the yeast packet and scissors in a contact sanitizer?

- How do you bottle, were these new bottles if not can you explain your cleaning and sanitation process?

- Was the priming sugar/water boiled then chilled?

Just some areas off the top of my head :)

Wolfracer · Dec 20, 2014

brewpirate said:
Sounds like you got an infection. If you are using plastic you have a decision to come to and will have to really really clean everything good with a good cleaner and hot water and possible bleach to make sure you kill whatever you got. Does your FV have any scratchs?

- Was there any film on top of the FV before you bottled or did you notice any film in the bottles?
Film? There was hops scum in the fv, yes.

- How do you clean your FV, what products and any rags/scour pads/etc
THIS IS WHERE I THINK THE PROBLEM LIES.
I've recently swapped to brucleans from milton, in fact, I changed on the APA and IPA brews...
And being honest, i didn't rinse.

- Can you explain your brewing process and how you ferment?
As per instructions, always. FV untilll no activity, then into bottles, week in warm, then into cold.

- Was the seal not on the FV properly or any gaps?
i crack the FV at the opener, but its sealed all the rest of the way around, bar a gas escape.

- What came in contact with the beer after you chilled?
After chilling nowt, just the bottle.

- How did you pitch the yeast? Did you dip the yeast packet and scissors in a contact sanitizer?
Nope

- How do you bottle, were these new bottles if not can you explain your cleaning and sanitation process?

normally using milton, but from these brews onwards using brewcleans... dump in sink, allow to fill to brim, put on draining board. X20. empty back into sink and drain.

- Was the priming sugar/water boiled then chilled?
Youngs sugar. straight in.

Just some areas off the top of my head :)

thats thorough! Thanks.

I think it lies in not rinsing the sterilising solution. But doesn't account for succesful brews since...

brewpirate · Dec 20, 2014

Not rinsing would give you an off flavor not a rancid batch.

Did you notice a film like this across the top of the batch?

Do you use a bottling bucket?

Any valves that the beer touched after the yeast pitch? If so take them apart and clean the hell out of em

In the future its good practice to sanitize the outside of the package as well the scissors you are going to open it with.

Get a food safe bucket and use that instead of your sink. Just an extra added layer of precaution.

Do you scrub the bottles out good and rinse after consuming?

For priming sugar, boil the water and sugar then seal in a sanitized container till you are ready to bottle. The you have chilled sanitized priming solution.

Check your FV for scratches and give it a good scrub down.

BigJC · Dec 20, 2014

Are you sure you didn't brew Skol by mistake?

Wolfracer · Dec 23, 2014

brewpirate said:
Not rinsing would give you an off flavor not a rancid batch.

Did you notice a film like this across the top of the batch?

Do you use a bottling bucket?

Any valves that the beer touched after the yeast pitch? If so take them apart and clean the hell out of em

In the future its good practice to sanitize the outside of the package as well the scissors you are going to open it with.

Get a food safe bucket and use that instead of your sink. Just an extra added layer of precaution.

Do you scrub the bottles out good and rinse after consuming?

For priming sugar, boil the water and sugar then seal in a sanitized container till you are ready to bottle. The you have chilled sanitized priming solution.

Check your FV for scratches and give it a good scrub down.

Couldn't see a film, per se, as there was a load of hops muck floating on the top. Same as the IPA I did at the same time.

The sink is washed down, very thoroughly with antibac spray, then rinsed and rinsed again.
Bear in mind the other brew I did at the same time was absolutely fine.

The only differences were the 2 satchets of hops and the priming sugar from youngs.

I've brewed 3 Wherrys and a TC since, and they are all good.

I've had a response from Youngs, they've asked for more info which I've provided, so we'll see.
They have said a sample would be good...

brewpirate · Dec 23, 2014

Boy they are brave... well sounds like you are good I don't see an outright culprit. Hopefully they can find out what happened. Give that FV a good cleaning and check for scratches

Good luck :)

Wolfracer · Dec 23, 2014

brewpirate said:
Boy they are brave... well sounds like you are good I don't see an outright culprit. Hopefully they can find out what happened. Give that FV a good cleaning and check for scratches

Good luck :)

Cheers,
Its the time and effort that annoy me more than anything. Especially as the Youngs' IPA's take a lot longer anyway.

Oh, well, here's hoping for a good response, before I start my first and last American Amber Ale kit from Youngs....

Wolfracer · Feb 8, 2015

Youngs replaced the kit foc and asked for updates..
Its been fermenting for 2 weeks now and theres some ugly looking krausen on the top.
Is this right?

Youngs APA tastes like Poison

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