question about clearing a beer.

It appears that after cold crashing a beer some home brewers use gelatine to further clear their beer. This for me is out of the question because its a derivitive of an animal product. I just wondered to what extent cold crashing will clear a beer (my beer is presently outside and in Glasgow UK the temperature is 5 Celsius.) I also believe that there are other products such as Irish Moss and whirfloc tablets which are plant derivatives (from seaweed) and entirely acceptable.

The products you mention are generally added much earlier in the process, towards the end of the boiling that precedes the actual brewing.

If your beer is cloudy after such a short time, then that is quite understandable. Time is your best friend on that one. Time is the main thing a home brewer has that a commercial brewer has not. Just give it a chance, mate.

You a Chess player, BTW?

Mir Sultan Khan was a great player, almost uneducated by Western standards and knew very little of the opening theory of the day (such as it was) and played ultra strong positional chess seemingly by instinct.

Some of his games are commented here in the series "Evolution of Chess Style".

https://www.youtube.com/user/kingscrusher

Slid said:

The products you mention are generally added much earlier in the process, towards the end of the boiling that precedes the actual brewing.

If your beer is cloudy after such a short time, then that is quite understandable. Time is your best friend on that one. Time is the main thing a home brewer has that a commercial brewer has not. Just give it a chance, mate.

You a Chess player, BTW?

Mir Sultan Khan was a great player, almost uneducated by Western standards and knew very little of the opening theory of the day (such as it was) and played ultra strong positional chess seemingly by instinct.

Some of his games are commented here in the series "Evolution of Chess Style".

https://www.youtube.com/user/kingscrusher

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Yes I am a chess player and yes he was a great player, won the British championship a few times. Was of course neither a Mir or a Sultan

Ok i will give beer a chance thanks for the advice, when I took specific gravity reading I could not help but taste it from the trial jar, was quite tasty

I used young's beer finings before that worked great, the active compound is chitosan which is derived from crustacean shells, so I guess it depends whether you would use fish products. If not, polyclar is just plastic dust but I have never used this.

pluckthechicken said:

I used young's beer finings before that worked great, the active compound is chitosan which is derived from crustacean shells, so I guess it depends whether you would use fish products. If not, polyclar is just plastic dust but I have never used this.

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Hmmm, many thanks, Ill check them out. There is a similar gelling agent called Agar, which does essentially the same thing as gelatine but is entirely a plant derivative. Its used as a substitute in foods and for clearing liquids but I can find little information on its use in the brewing process.

mirsultankhan said:

Hmmm, many thanks, Ill check them out. There is a similar gelling agent called Agar, which does essentially the same thing as gelatine but is entirely a plant derivative. Its used as a substitute in foods and for clearing liquids but I can find little information on its use in the brewing process.

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Agar could be worth a look, but I'm not sure whether it can be used as fining agent (gelling agent doesn't necessarily mean fining agent, I don't think)... also you may find it quite expensive!

tbh i dont use any finnings after the kettle, i have used em in the past and found em too much hassle without any noticable benefit. at the end of the primary fermentation when they are added is just when you dont want to start mixing any air into the brew, and to mix thoroughly without disturbing the sediment that has already dropped out generally involves a transfer to a secondary FV which in itself can expose the brew to air and microbes you would rather avoid..
Time and gravity will drop out all the sediment in the bottle or keg ok
finnings will help clear a green beer a bit quicker so it can be supped within a few weeks of casking, but if your letting your beer mature for 3-4weeks after conditioning clarity of the final product shouldnt be much of an issue, and even if it is an opaque supping mug is the simplest solution




the irish moss and protofloc tabs are both kettle finnings used in the last 15mins of a boil to help clump /coagulate the break proteins that should not apply to a kit brew.

I'm quite to brewing, and I brewed my first Wilko Golden Ale kit last year and became concerned when mine didn't seem to clearing after 6 weeks. I kept mine in a cold shed, and about a week or two after bringing it into the house it went crystal clear without any additives. I guess the cold slows the process down, or chill haze. I'd give it a cozy environment and a week or two before adding anything. If it works for you let me know, as I've brewed four kits since, and they are all behave the same. I'm also not frightened of drinking cloudy now either after reading a post stating I drink with my mouth👅 not my eyes 👀

Essentially i put my beer outside and covered over the fermeting vessel with a black polythene bag. First night temperature was 3 Celsius, second night it was about 7-9 Celsius, today it was just touching 6 Celsius. When i pulled it in and siphoned it into my secondary I cannot believe what a difference it has made. Sure its still a little hazy but nothing like it was three days ago. Amazing!:

Whirl floc / Irish Moss is a negative has a negative charged and is attracted to positive charged proteins. Gelatin is a carries positive charge and there for goes after negative charged proteins. When you drop to cold crashing temperatures you allowing proteins to form and fall out of suspension making a clear beer :)

brewpirate said:

When you drop to cold crashing temperatures you allowing proteins to form and fall out of suspension making a clear beer :)

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I've always wondered... does this mean you have to siphon off the beer before the beer warms up again and the proteins dissolve back into solution? Or is the precipitation permanent after binding to the fining agent?

pluckthechicken said:

I've always wondered... does this mean you have to siphon off the beer before the beer warms up again and the proteins dissolve back into solution? Or is the precipitation permanent after binding to the fining agent?

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Depends.

When you bring it down the temp you are helping the yeast to flocculate, if the beer warms back I don't believe a large portion will go back into suspension.

Now with the proteins I believe they will disappear again as the temp comes up so you will need to gelatin to grab on to them and help them out.

I will have to check on this though :)

Hi, stick it outside for a week or so that's the way to find out (especially at the moment, unless you live in the tropics of course)! The proteins will fall to the bottom and should be left behind when you syphon the beer off (anyhow I've never actually used finings in any of my brews just the cold and a bit of time)! PS or try bentonite powder this might be a bit wasteful of your wort as it forms quite a crust and needs to made in advance.

I used Gelatine in my last brew a forward hopped IPA as I have concerns that I may have developed a yeast allergy (will do another thread for that!) and was looking at a clearer and hopefully reduced yeast brew.

Basically I forgot to add Irish Moss at the end of the boil but just cooled and fermented as usual in the fermenting chamber at a steady 19c for 2 weeks then transferred into a secondary and dropped the temperature to 2c for 24 hours before adding the dissolved gelatine and leaving for another 7 days (at 2c) before bottling.

The result was a crystal clear brew, a result never before reached, the bottles were primed as usual and stored at 20c so far for a week but will leave in the warm for another week or 2, the tester so far is flat but tasty!

Not sure if it will work for my potential allergy problems but for clearing the beer the difference to me was like night and day.

I used Dr Oetker Gelatine in the little packets which I found in Sainsburys for a couple of quid for 3 packets.