'Leftovers' Red Ale Parti-gyle Brew

Hi all, planning this one for my next brew in an attempt to clear out my leftovers.

I love IPAs, APAs, AIPAs, DIPAs. Hops.
My Dad doesn't.
He much prefers traditional red ales along the lines of Speckled Hen, Abbot, Spitfire, Bishops Finger etc. So I figured I'd brew something he'd actually like to drink :lol:

However, perhaps selfishly, I don't want to end up with 50+ bottles of this sitting around so my plan is to split the batch in 2 and use the 1st runnings to make a juicy, super hoppy red IPA and the 2nd runnings to make a traditional red ale.

To quote my Dad, he likes his beers 'chewy' so I've added the crystal and chocolate as follows.

Here's the base recipe:

First Half

Dad's Beer 'Leftovers'
Red Ale

Batch Size (L): 20.0 (2x10.0)
Original Gravity (OG): 1.048
Final Gravity (FG): 1.011
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 4.9
Bitterness (IBU): 33.3 (Average)

Grain Bill
----------------
4.000 kg Maris Otter Malt (85.1%)
0.600 kg Crystal (12.8%)
0.100 kg Chocolate Malt (2.1%)

Hop Bill #1
----------------
10.0 g Magnum Leaf (12.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
10.0 g Challenger Leaf (8.58% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Challenger Leaf (8.58% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)

Misc Bill
----------------
1/4 Whirlfloc tablet @ 15 Minutes (Boil)

Mash at 66�C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20�C with Danstar Nottingham

For the first time, I'm experimenting with different yeasts and moving away from US-05. From what I've read I think Nottingham should work well with this. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

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So I'm going to do the above but mash with twice the amount of everything then split in two.

I have the following hops available:

80g Pacific Jade @ 15.6%
54g Magnum @ 12.5%
70g Kohatu @ 5.9%
30g Motueka @ 10.5%
20g Wai-iti @ 4.0%
43g Cascade @ 8.6%
70g Cascade @ 7.0%

I'll probably still get some more hops, thinking a monster AA for initial bittering (Apollo, Nugget, Warrior etc) and if I can get hold of some I'd like to dry hop the hell out of it with some Amarillo. I'd like to be around the 80-90 IBU mark, I want this to be a real juicy one.

Long-winded post I know, always end up getting carried away.

If you've made it to the end, I'd love your help on this one!

Great plan!

In the English version maybe lob some First Gold in with the Challenger?

I love the big American hops in a red ale. Amarillo is great especially if you pair it with something like Columbus, Centennial, Simcoe, Chinook. Apollo or nugget would be good too. I had a red ale in the pub last week that was Amarillo and Centennial and it was magnificent.

Nottingham is good for this kind of beer. It's similar to US05, but different.

Great stuff, I'll look into some first gold, I've heard good things on here.

Not too sure on what SG I'll get for the two, I'm estimating 1.060 first runnings, 1.030 second. Sound about right? Is there a rule of thumb for this?

Depending on actual figures, I may boost the IPA half with some sugar.

As for yeast, would the 1 packet be enough between the 2? Even if the one half is quite a high gravity?

Thanks Clibit.

You don't need First gold, Challenger is great, I just think FG would enhance it.

Are you mixing the two runnings at all or completely separate?

If it's a total of 20 litres one dried yeast packet should be fine.

There's a partigyle table here that might help you. It obviously depends on the volume of each of the runnings.

http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue2.2/moshertable.html

I'll plan to keep them separate. But until I see what I get it's hard to say. I usually get 28 litres pre boil down to 20 after hop and trub loss and cooling. Though I may chuck a little more grain into the mix cos the smaller volumes will boil off quicker. I'll add a little more Crystal and choc when I sparge as well, colour loss was something I never considered, thanks for that article.

It's hard to say, but that's where the fun is! Hopefully get this one going this week.

It'll be a fun thing to do. :thumb:

Ok, got next Wednesday off so it's a brew date with myself.
Looking more into the part-gyle thing, a 1.060 wort should give me 1.080 from the 1st runnings and 1.040 from the 2nd which is exactly what I'm after.
I've settled on Columbus, Centennial and Amarillo as my hops of choice for the DIPA, I've not used them (apart from Amarillo). That said, I'm struggling to get hold of everything I need. Centennial and Amarillo in particular. May have to go down the pellet route, haven't used these before.

I've tweaked the recipe as follows, and here is my new hop schedule.

Dad's Beer 'Leftovers'
Red Ale

Batch Size (L): 20.0 (2x10.0)
Original Gravity (OG): 1.080/1.040
Final Gravity (FG): 1.014
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 9.5 / 5.0 (Approx)
Bitterness (IBU): 89 / 37 (Average)

Grain Bill
----------------
5.200 kg Maris Otter Malt (89.7%)
0.500 kg Crystal (8.6%)
0.100 kg Chocolate Malt (1.7%)

Hop Bill #1 (for 10 litres)
----------------
10.0 g Magnum (12.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
10.0 g Challenger (8.58% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil)
10.0 g First Gold (7.9% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)
10.0 g First Gold (7.9% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Steep for 30 minutes)



Hop Bill #2 (for 10 litres)
----------------
15.0 g Columbus (15.6% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
10.0 g Centennial (10.7% Alpha) @ 20 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Amarillo (8.9% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Centennial (10.7% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Amarillo (8.9% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Centennial (10/7% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Amarillo (8.9% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Centennial (10.7% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)
10.0 g Amarillo (8.9% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Steep for 30 minutes)
10.0 g Centennial (10.7% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Steep for 30 minutes)
50.0 g Amarillo (8.9% Alpha) Dry hop for 5 days

Misc Bill
----------------
1/4 Whirlfloc tablet @ 15 Minutes (Boil)

Mash at 66�C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20�C with Danstar Nottingham

Let me know what you all think!

Fantastic plan that, great hop choices, I'm salivating looking at both of them. :thumb:

If all goes well, I'll make sure to send a bottle of both your way! You've been a massive help on almost everything I've ever posted on here :)

Cheers. Good luck with the brew day, it's an ambitious thing to do! But will be really good fun and very rewarding.

Hops and a couple of other bits and pieces ordered!
Went through Geterbrewed for the first time, they seemed to have the biggest range available and most importantly had lots of lovely Amarillo in stock so I've bought a few packs to keep me going. I found that Centennial was the hardest to get hold of. Was also really impressed with how reasonably priced they were.

Going to use pellets for the first time on the imperial half, using that amount of leaf hops in such a small batch I want to be sure I actually have some beer left to go into the fermenter! Bottling my session IPA Tuesday, should have this bad boy going on Wednesday. Updates to follow.

I'm using pellets more now, good for the small batches. :thumb:

Could this now be moved to the beer brewday section if possible?

One of my ever more common essays on its way.

Brewed this today. Well, tried to. Funny how just when I think I've got my head around this brewing lark it all goes **** up.

Opened my package from Geterbrewed and noticed that the crush of all the grains, particularly the Maris Otter seemed very coarse and it seemed very 'old' looking (not sure how best else to explain it).

Final grain bill was:
4.600kg MO Pale
0.600kg Munich
0.500kg Crystal (150 EBC)
0.100g Chocolate

After my 5 previous brews I have my efficiency pretty nailed on 66%. According to BS I should have got 1.052 preboil. I only managed to hit 1.040. I'm fairy sure I did everything right, I had modified my mash tun further and managed to hold 66 degrees for the entire hour (a first for me). I had 20ish litres of strike water and only managed to extract 9 litres of first runnings - I've never seen grain absorb anything like that amount. The first runnings were only 1.050. Sparge went fine and I got 25 litres in the pot.

I've had a look around online and I've seen others report some issues with efficiency with Geterbrewed basic pale malt. I'm not going to make any sort of accusation or complaint because I'm not nearly experienced enough and my processes aren't nearly polished nor consistent enough to make a fair and honest judgement. I'm going to get some more malt of a brand I know and from suppliers I've used before. I'm going to try the exact same brew and see what happens. My main point is that the biggest variable for this brew day was a change in base malt. Though obviously I can't rule out errors on my part or equipment issues.

Aaaaaaannnnnnnnnwwwwaaaaayy. I scrapped the whole split brew idea and decided to make a nice hoppy red - colour came out great by the way.

Hop schedule changed to this:

20g Columbus 12.7% @ 60mins.
10g Amarillo 8.8% @ 15mins
10g Centennial 8.5% @ 15mins
10g Amarillo 8.8% @ 10mins
10g Centennial 8.5% @ 10mins
10g Amarillo 8.8% @ 5mins
10g Centennial 8.5% @ 5mins
15g Amarillo 8.8% @ Flameout (steep for 30mins)
15g Centennial 8.5% @ Flameout (steep for 30mins)

Gives me 59 IBUS.
I also chucked half a small bag of demerara sugar in that I had lying around in an attempt to boost it a tad.

OG ended up at 1.052, currently no chilling it, will pitch some Nottingham in the morning if it's cool enough.

Then we wait and see if anything drinkable comes out!

The hops will win the day. I'm sure. Should be great

clibit said:

The hops will win the day. I'm sure. Should be great

Click to expand...

Fingers crossed!

Well, first time using Nottingham - it doesn't **** about! Already down to 1.010! Gonna leave it another week to settle out, dry hop then bottle!

I have had the same problem with their grain too on my latest brew, I agree about the crush and the oldness thing. I bunged a ton of Amarillo and Centennial in as well, which should hopefully over-ride any grain issues.

clibit said:

I have had the same problem with their grain too on my latest brew, I agree about the crush and the oldness thing. I bunged a ton of Amarillo and Centennial in as well, which should hopefully over-ride any grain issues.

Click to expand...

Cough THBC is calling :whistle:

clibit said:

I have had the same problem with their grain too on my latest brew, I agree about the crush and the oldness thing. I bunged a ton of Amarillo and Centennial in as well, which should hopefully over-ride any grain issues.

Click to expand...

Well that's sort of a relief I guess. Shame, mind. Also, I ordered some Amarillo leaf hops, and the packet was open when I opened the box. They went straight on the freezer.

And that's also my plan, gonna whack a load of Amarillo dry hops in.

Bottled this today. 1.054 - 1.010 leaves me at roughly 5.8%. I ended up chucking 50g of Centennial and 50g of Amarillo in as dry hops, it smells like a monster. Love it. Not sure what I've ended up with but fairly confident it'll be drinkable. I definitely need to work on better filtration systems when bottling. Definitely going to use a muslin bag if I dry hop with pellets again. Got a few 'hazy' bottles to say the least.