Brexit

[Chippy_Tea]

The Turkeys will never vote for Christmas on a reform.

The system is Bent AF.

Was never a fan of Brexit, thought the remain campaign was embarrassing too. Cannot believe we are still at each others throats about it nearly 6 years on

Spot on Covrich.

 

[Brianbrewed]

That leaves pages 1 to 4 and 7 so a good few to go yet, 1000 was a joke and as I assume you have visited the site I am sure you knew that.

It was a joke? Ok.
Visited the site, I just scanned through the PDF to be honest as I haven't time to read the entire document.

I'll read the bullet points later and have a counter-arguement for some of them later.
Probably take a while though.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

The Turkeys will never vote for Christmas on a reform.

The system is Bent AF.

Was never a fan of Brexit, thought the remain campaign was embarrassing too. Cannot believe we are still at each others throats about it nearly 6 years on

Spot on Covrich

 

[Chippy_Tea]

It was a joke? Ok.
Visited the site, I just scanned through the PDF to be honest as I haven't time to read the entire document.

I'll read the bullet points later and have a counter-arguement for some of them later.
Probably take a while though.

I would save yourself the time I doubt more than a handful of members will bother reading it and probably the same ones that read the bullet points I posted, you are never going to convince those that voted out they were wrong to do so and like Covrich said it's undeliverable after all this time the ones that voted to stay are still bitching because they lost.

 

[samale]

I would save yourself the time you are never going to convince those that voted out they were wrong to do so and like Covrich said it's undeliverable after all this time the ones that voted to stay are still bitching because they lost.

You would need to read his statement again, at no point did he say the people that voted to stay are still bitching.
You added your own spin to his statement
Just fact checking

 

[samale]

Was never a fan of Brexit, thought the remain campaign was embarrassing too. Cannot believe we are still at each others throats about it nearly 6 years on

That is the original statement you are referring to

 

[Brianbrewed]

If you would like to go through all the points and tell us which are lies backed up by facts feel free stating its all tory lies doesn't cut it.

I would save yourself the time I doubt more than a handful of members will bother reading it and probably the same ones that read the bullet points I posted, you are never going to convince those that voted out they were wrong to do so and like Covrich said it's undeliverable after all this time the ones that voted to stay are still bitching because they lost.

Well you asked @Dutto to go through all the points (all 22). Thought I would give him some un-solicited help.

As for saving my time, I enjoy current affairs, politics and history so I enjoy it.

As for convincing people to change their minds, no interest in doing that, never had.

 

[Dutto]

I would save yourself the time I doubt more than a handful of members will bother reading it and probably the same ones that read the bullet points I posted, you are never going to convince those that voted out they were wrong to do so and like Covrich said it's undeliverable after all this time the ones that voted to stay are still bitching because they lost.

Sorry but a valid complaint can’t be classed as “bitching” and it is still relevant.

The lies people were told by the biggest pro “leave” campaigner is now our PM; and he is still lying to the UK public

I wrote:

“A leopard never changes its spots!”​

and Boris has proved my point and still tells lies!

 

[Chippy_Tea]

You would need to read his statement again, at no point did he say the people that voted to stay are still bitching.
You added your own spin to his statement
Just fact checking

I didn't say he did!

 

[An Ankoù]

As for convincing people to change their minds, no interest in doing that, never had.

...and you'd be wasting you time. You'd have a better chance of getting Spurs' supporters to start backing Arsenal.

 

[Brewnaldo]

Sorry but a valid complaint can’t be classed as “bitching” and it is still relevant.

The lies people were told by the biggest pro “leave” campaigner is now our PM; and he is still lying to the UK public

I wrote:

“A leopard never changes its spots!”​

and Boris has proved my point and still tells lies!

It's an odd wee turn of events for a democracy, that no one is allowed to complain about the consequences of a referendum. Never mind one that was so well seasoned with a combination of lies and overt racism in order to get it over the line....

 

[Brianbrewed]

● Ended free movement and taken back control of our borders. In its place we have introduced a points -based immigration system, focused on skilled workers and the best global talent, with skills and salary thresholds and an English - language requirement. The UK has welcomed thousands of workers with the skills the country needs to support our domestic labour market as we build back better from the Covid pandemic, from doctors and scientists to butchers and bricklayers.

This is one article that questions how Brexit has controlled immigration into Britain. (the first bullet point from the PDF.).

https://www.cidob.org/en/publicatio..._uk_has_not_taken_back_control_of_immigration
It is quite a short article from March last year.
In case you haven't time I'll put in some bullet points from the article;

• Before Brexit, the UK was not part of the Schengen area and British authorities already controlled passengers crossing their borders
• July 2014 to June 2015, Non-EU net migration in the UK was positive by 163,000. Four years later, it had increased 224,000. Brexit does not mean more, but less control of this rising inflow. First, as the UK has exited Dublin cooperation, it can no longer return irregular asylum seekers who had transited through the EU.
• Second, the UK has lost a stable framework to cooperate with the EU on migration in the Mediterranean. Therefore, the UK’s withdrawal from the missions to stem this inflow may result in more irregular immigration.
• UK was among the most active Europol members and now keeps only distant cooperation with this EU agency that combats immigrant smuggling. The UK has lost its seat on Europol’s management board, and British officers can no longer interrogate the Europol database. Less cooperation will impair British efforts to dismantle immigrant smuggling networks.
• With Brexit, the UK has achieved more control of the inflow of EU citizens. However, this inflow had been plummeting. Between July 2014 and June 2015, net migration from the EU to the UK was positive by 212,000–with central and eastern European migrants accounting for 60 per cent (125,000). Four years later, the total had shrunk to 48,000 – with the share of central and eastern European migrants down to about 40 per cent (21,000).
• Meanwhile, more control of flows from the EU has come at an excessive cost for the UK. Britons have lost their free movement rights and the related opportunities to reside, study, work or provide services in Europe.

@Dutto has done three, I have done one. That leaves 18 more.

 

[Dutto]

…. Covrich said it's undeliverable after all this time the ones that voted to stay are still bitching because they lost.

You would need to read his statement again, at no point did he say the people that voted to stay are still bitching.
…..
I didn't say he did!

Er … I think the phrase is “squaring the circle” …

… or someone is able to mess with the “Quotes” so that no-one really knows who said what!
:hat:

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Well you asked @Dutto to go through all the points (all 22). Thought I would give him some un-solicited help.
As for saving my time, I enjoy current affairs, politics and history so I enjoy it.
As for convincing people to change their minds, no interest in doing that, never had.

Oh well if you enjoy doing it fill your boots.

 

[Brianbrewed]

Oh well if you enjoy doing it fill your boots.

Grand.
Will do.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

A Global Britain Our departure from the EU has given us an unprecedented opportunity to forge new alliances and strengthen our partnerships around the world. The interests of the British people now lie at the heart of everything we do around the world—from our trade policy to our sanctions policy.

● Agreed trade deals with 70 countries plus the EU . This includes landmark deals with close partners including Australia and Japan. We have also launched negotiations on a trade deal with India —a market of 1.4 billion people. These deals are tailor made to benefit British businesses and consumers —creating jobs and expanding choice.
● Became a dialogue partner of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN). The partnership, which is the first ASEAN has agreed in 25 years, will lead to closer cooperation between the UK and the region on a range of issues such as trade, investment, climate change, the environment, science, technology and education.
● Reaffirm our commitment to work together with the United States to realise our vision for a more peaceful and prosperous future. The new Atlantic Charter, building on the commitments and aspirations set out eighty years ago, affirms our ongoing commitment to sustaining our enduring values and defending them against new and old challenges.
● Retaken our seat at the World Trade Organization as an independent trading nation. The UK is using its regained independent seat to champion World Trade Organization reform and stabilise the Multilateral Trading System, to conclude future-leaning negotiations to secure commercial benefits and opportunities for British business and to modernise trade r ules in order to strengthen UK and global trade and support UK economic growth.
● Established an independent sanctions policy. Our new independent sanctions policy means we are more agile when deciding how and where to use sanctions, while continuing to coordinate with our international partners. The UK uses its sanctions regimes as part of an integrated approach to promote our values and interests and to combat state threats, terrorism, cyber-attacks and the use and proliferation of chemical weapons. We were the first European country to sanction the regime in Belarus and, overall, the UK imposed sanctions against 160 individuals and entities in its first full year running a fully independent UK sanctions policy. 18 The Benefits of Brexit: How the UK is taking advantage of leaving the EU
● Established a strategic partnership with Australia and the USA (AUKUS). This new partnership will protect our people, strengthen our alliances with like - minded allies, deepen our ties in the Indo -Pacific. Its first initiative is collaboration on future nuclear-powered submarines for the Royal Australian Navy.
● Promoting our defence exports. Our UK Defence and Security Industrial Strategy sets the framework for a deeper, more sophisticated and strategic relationship with industry and promotes investment in the UK and defence exports. It includes a package of legislative reform, policy changes and internal transformation that will improve the speed and simplicity of procurement, provide more flexibility in how we procure and support capability and stimulate innovation and technology exploitation.
● Began accession negotiations to join the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership. Accession could mean tariff -free trade for 99.9% of our exports, including cars and food and drink, while also creating new opportunities for modern industries like technology and services, ultimately supporting and creating high -value jobs across the UK. ● Launched trade deal negotiations with India. India is one of the world’s largest and fastest growing economies. We want t o slash existing barriers on UK exports to this growing market and a bold new deal would put UK businesses at the front of the queue to supply India’s growing middle class.
● Deployed the UK’s Carrier Strike Group, led by HMS Queen Elizabeth to the Bay of Bengal. This was a powerful demonstration of the UK -India Comprehensive Strategic Partnership, agreed in May 2021, and the UK's commitment to deepening its diplomatic, economic and security -based ties in the Indo-Pacific region.
● Agreed more ambitious provisions for digital trade. The UK is agreeing ground-breaking digital provisions in new trade deals, including in our trade deal with Japan and the Digital Economy Agreement we have agreed with Singapore . We are leading on tackling protectionism in online tr ade internationally, to the benefit of UK businesses and consumers. Advancing digital trade could also help to boost wages in the UK, with employees in the digital sector earning around 50% more than the UK average.
● Launched our ambitious Export Strategy to support British businesses exporting globally. Our 12-point Export Strategy, ‘Made in the UK, Sold to the World’ provides businesses with the tools they need to become a nation of exporters and reap the benefits of our free trade deals. The ‘Race to £1 trillion’ worth of exports per year by the end of this decade means more jobs, more opportunities and higher wages, helping to level up the UK and build back better. The Benefits of Brexit: How the UK is taking advantage of leaving the EU 19
● Continuing UK Export Finance mission. UK Export Finance’s mission is to ensure no viable UK export fails for lack of finance or insurance, while operating at no net cost to the taxpayer. In 2020–21 UK Export Finance provided £12.3 billion in support for UK exports, providing direct support to 549 businesses, in addition to thousands in their supply chains. SMEs made up 79% of the companies seeking UK Export Finance’s direct support for finance and insurance. In providing support to businesses, UK Export Finance has created or maintained around 107,000 UK jobs in 2020–2021.
● Defending UK economic interests. We created the Trade Remedies Authority to help defend UK economic interests by investigating complaints from UK industries about unfair trading practices and unforeseen surges in imports. It can recommend the imposition of new trade remedy measures, such as tariffs, to stop injury to UK producers harmed by the unfair trading practices.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Support for people and families New freedoms allow us to put money back into the pockets of hard-working people and families, enhance consumer rights and protections and improve education, healthcare and patient safety.

● Protecting consumers in the Covid pandemic. We have allowed consumers to make more of their purchases contact -free, by raising the contactless limit to £100, which could not have been done in the EU.
● Removing the EU’s ‘Vnuk’ motor insurance law to prevent increased premiums for GB motorists. The Government is supporting the Bill that Peter Bone MP is taking through Parliament that will remove the effect of the European Court of Justice’s “ Vnuk” judgement on motor insurance in Great Britain. The Bill achieves the Government’s aim of removing the Court’s extension of motor insurance to private land and a greater range of vehicles and removing the associated financial liability imposed on the Motor Insurers’ Bureau. This will avoid a potential increase in insurance premiums of around £50 a year.
● Reducing the cost of holidays in Europe. We are extending the Tour Operators Margin Scheme VAT rules for package holiday companies selling holidays i n the EU, which are now subject to a zero rate of UK VAT instead of the standard rate.
● Reviewing Aviation Consumer Policy to improve the consumer rights of air passengers. We will reposition the UK’s approach to air passenger consumer rights, improving consumer confidence and developing trust in booking travel by consulting on additional, flexible and modern tools to enforce consumer rights.
● Providing life-changing experiences and opportunities in education and training across the world through the Turing Scheme. We have set up the Turing Scheme, a new international educational exchange scheme that provides funding for international opportunities in education and training across the world so that UK students, learners and pupils can experience a wider range of cultures and international education institutions.
● Delivering modern digital services for drivers that match the public’s expectations. We will introduce digital driving licences, test certificates and MOT testing, doing away with paper test certificates and bringing MOTs into the modern age in a way that is greener and more efficient.
● Improving the education of our children by allowing aspiring teachers from all around the world to earn Qualified Teacher Status in the UK. We have published new International Qualified Teacher Status Standards allowing us to 14 The Benefits of Brexit: How the UK is taking advantage of leaving the EU attract the best and brightest aspiring teachers to the UK to help inspire the next generation.
● Saving UK consumers money by allowing them to do more of their shopping duty free. We have reinstated duty free shopping for all overseas destinations, including the EU and increased allowances from British ports and airports.
● Transforming the UK’s approach to clinical trials research and providing the British public with faster access to new, innovative medical treatments. We are transforming the way we approach clinical trial research to improve the speed and efficiency of study set-up of clinical trials. And we are reforming the regulations to facilitate new innovative medical treatment s reaching the UK public faster and to help ensure the UK life sciences sector leads the world and provides more skilled jobs.
● Improving the service people receive from our NHS. Through the Health and Care Bill currently before Parliament, we are establishing a new bespoke health procurement regime to enable our NHS to arrange healthcare services more flexibly, reducing bureaucracy and waste and enabling it to provide a better, m ore efficient service to the British public.
● Improving the safety of patients. We are developing a world-leading regulatory framework for medical devices that prioritises patient and public safety. For example, we are reviewing how devices are assessed b efore being placed on the market and considering strengthening the duties of manufacturers, importers and distributors.
● Taking steps to strengthen the consumer Cannabidiol (CBD) market. We will respond to the recommendations from the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs and set out how we propose to amend the law to allow for trace controlled drug content in consumer CBD products for the first time. This will help compliant businesses to enter this market and will drive companies with potentially harmful products out of it, making the market safer for consumers.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

I just realised i said earlier there are 5 pages as well as the ones i pasted yesterday it turns out there are 101.

 

[Brianbrewed]

Grand
Love Reading fiction

 

[Brianbrewed]

● Restored democratic control over our lawmaking. We gave the power to make and scrutinise the laws that apply to us back to our Parliament and the devolved Parliaments so that they are now made in Belfast, Cardiff, Edinburgh and London, not Brussels.

This bullet point from the byline times has a counter arguement for the second bullet point.

https://bylinetimes.com/2022/02/01/fact-checking-the-governments-benefits-of-brexit-report/
‘RESTORED THE UK SUPREME COURT AS THE FINAL ARBITER OF THE LAW THAT APPLIES IN THE UK’
While this may be true to some extent, the UK Government is engaged in a protracted and heated row with the EU about the ongoing oversight of the European Court of Justice (ECJ) over the Northern Ireland Protocol – which governs the post-Brexit trading terms between the EU, Britain and Northern Ireland.

The UK agreed to this arrangement during Brexit negotiations, only later deciding that it isn’t comfortable with the role of the ECJ.

What’s more, although Brexit may have increased the authority of UK courts, Boris Johnson’s Government is simultaneously attempting to curtail the power of the judiciary – seeking to reform the ways in which judicial reviews can challenge the decisions of government.


Actually the entire article has a counter arguement for each point in the Government paper @Chippy_Tea posted.

Thats 5 down 96 to go.