L.p.g.

The Homebrew Forum

Help Support The Homebrew Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Chippy_Tea

Administrator.
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Messages
50,762
Reaction score
18,802
Location
Ulverston Cumbria.
Why are the government pushing electric cars when we have L.P.G, as the the site below says it is a by-product, it burns cleaner, its half the price of petrol and the cars we have today can use it with a modification which costs less than the scrappage they paid for old cars a couple of years ago.



LPG produces 33% less CO2 emissions than petrol and 45% less CO2 than diesel. LPG vehicles produce up to 82% less Nitrogen Oxide pollutants than petrol and 99% better than diesel ! 63% less Carbon Monoxide. 40% less Hydrocarbons than petrol and 70% less than diesel. 50% less particulates than petrol and 98% less than diesel.

Secondly, it is produced as a by-product of oil extraction and refining operations. The UK produces a surplus of millions of tonnes each year, LPG is by far the most valuable use for it.

LPG burns cleaner than petrol.

This means less emissions out of the exhaust and less carbon deposits in the engine.

These deposits are very abrasive and can contribute to engine breakdowns.

The oil and spark plugs will also last longer due to less wear and tear.

http://www.dynamicassetrecovery.com/whats-best-lpg-petrol-or-diesel
 
Why are the government pushing electric cars when we have L.P.G
Because electric cars produce 100% fewer CO2 emissions than petrol, 100% less than diesel AND 100% less than LPG perhaps?

Plus, the general public loves a bit of new technology!
 
I don't think the government are particularly pushing electric cars - they're just acknowledging what is happening in car manufacturing. Car makers see electric as the future and the more they make in coming years the more expensive it will become to make IC cars due to numbers dropping. Eventually they'll stop making them altogether and I think it will happen long before the governments 2040 deadline. If there is such a surplus of LPG then they can just burn it in power stations.
 
Because electric cars produce 100% fewer CO2 emissions than petrol, 100% less than diesel AND 100% less than LPG perhaps?

Plus, the general public loves a bit of new technology!

The electricity used to charge their batteries has to be generated and if they become popular they are going to have to generate a lot more, the batteries they use have a short lifespan so that is also another consideration, L.PG basically free as it's a by-product and if I had to choose between electric and L.P.G I would not go electric.
 
If I was to describe my perfect lifestyle I would like to own my own house, grow my own veg, keep a few animals. I could have solar panels, a small wind turbine and then run an electric car whilst also using public transport for longer journeys that would be reliable and affordable.

As it stands I run a 2.4L petrol car, live in a rented flat and drive everywhere I can.

I would get an LPG conversion however the way i own my cars is to buy cheap and run them to the ground so £2000 for LPG is 2 times the cost of the car.
 
The electricity used to charge their batteries has to be generated and if they become popular they are going to have to generate a lot more, the batteries they use have a short lifespan so that is also another consideration, L.PG basically free as it's a by-product and if I had to choose between electric and L.P.G I would not go electric.

It's only a by product as long as we are producing fossil fuel. Hence as that declines so does the by product. Long time before that happens granted
 
Secondly, it is produced as a by-product of oil extraction and refining operations. The UK produces a surplus of millions of tonnes each year, LPG is by far the most valuable use for it.
I'm not sure where this idea comes from.
There is no 'surplus' as such.
Refineries are run so that they can extract the best mix of products from the incoming crude oil, and deliver the highest profitablity for the refinery owner given the capability of the refinery equipment and the market at the time. So very very little is wasted. And the flares you see at every refinery are there to provide a safe control on the refinery process not as a means to burn any 'surplus'.
There might be some propane and butane extracted from the natural gas we still extract from the North Sea, but my guess is that we now import most of it from overseas tankered in as LPG.
And we import other gas in liquified form. There are gas terminals around the UK coast for LNG, which we now require to boost 'natural gas' supplies given the North Sea supply is slowly declining. For example, there's a large LNG terminal at Milford Haven, ironically built on the site of an old refinery.
Anyone know any different?
 
If LPG is that good then keep it to yourself because the moment it starts to make a dent in fuel tax revenue then tax will be raised on it to make up the shortfall.

All-electric cars can be made with half-decent range - see Tesla for the current state of the art. Yes we'll need more power stations and goodness knows who's got the magic wand that's going to produce enough lithium but the idea on emissions is that they can be dealt with more effectively at the power station than at millions of exhaust pipes of unknown age and condition.

Anyway what happened to fuel-cell technology? Emissions = water.
 
Anyway what happened to fuel-cell technology? Emissions = water.

This is what i would be thinking at least from the lay mans pov, water in as fuel and water and oxygen out, only downside is potential fire from collisions so designing idiot proof handling/storage/usage is the only real concern.
 
I am not an engineer but doesn't a part of electricity generate some power from braking and charging..

It isn't perhaps a lot but the technology is in its infancy.

I know we are engineering them where I work for the recycling trucks.. its a little like the Kers system on F1 cars..
 
Electric cars, if we all have one, will use at least 12 Gwatts of electricity24 hours a day. We currently generate about 25 Gwatts but electric cars will mainly want to charge in the same 2 hour period at 6pm. That means we will need to generate an extra 144 Gwatts in this period. These are FACTS not OPINIONS. Maths is simple and I have an A level but you don't need one to do the sums.
BTW LPG is only cheap because of the lower tax. Tax it like petrol and diesel and it won't be cheap.
Now. Where's that wood powered steam car I fancied.
 
I'm not sure where this idea comes from.
There is no 'surplus' as such.
Refineries are run so that they can extract the best mix of products from the incoming crude oil, and deliver the highest profitablity for the refinery owner given the capability of the refinery equipment and the market at the time. So very very little is wasted. And the flares you see at every refinery are there to provide a safe control on the refinery process not as a means to burn any 'surplus'.
There might be some propane and butane extracted from the natural gas we still extract from the North Sea, but my guess is that we now import most of it from overseas tankered in as LPG.
And we import other gas in liquified form. There are gas terminals around the UK coast for LNG, which we now require to boost 'natural gas' supplies given the North Sea supply is slowly declining. For example, there's a large LNG terminal at Milford Haven, ironically built on the site of an old refinery.
Anyone know any different?

In case there is any confusion when members read Terrys post above-

Below is my part of the post in the OP the rest is from the site i linked to so i didn't say - Secondly, it is produced as a by-product of oil extraction and refining operations. The UK produces a surplus of millions of tonnes each year, LPG is by far the most valuable use for it..

Why are the government pushing electric cars when we have L.P.G, as the the site below says it is a by-product, it burns cleaner, its half the price of petrol and the cars we have today can use it with a modification which costs less than the scrappage they paid for old cars a couple of years ago.
 
It's only a by product as long as we are producing fossil fuel. Hence as that declines so does the by product. Long time before that happens granted

The long time part is spot on, i cannot ever see electric HGVs, busses and vans being commonplace, if you have to drive up to 10 hours a day far away from the depot it just isn't going to work.

.
 
BTW LPG is only cheap because of the lower tax. Tax it like petrol and diesel and it won't be cheap.

I cannot see LPG cars ever becoming widespread its been around for years and i don't know a single person that owns a converted car therefore i think if you were to get your car converted today it will be on the scrap heap long before the price changes to match petrol/diesel.

.
 
electric cars are not the answer - simple. never will be either! or should I say Plug-In electric cars.....
not everyone has a drive and there has access to a charger at home, some people cant access a charger at work, not everyone does short journeys or can cope with hours of recharging as part of their daily work schedule.
However it is a convenient and simple short term solution to localised pollution in city centres by a large part of the city population and should continue to be encouraged.
Economies of scale mean that overall pollution from producing the electricity for these cars will be much lower (and more fuel efficient) than what comes out of a typical combustion engine.

however the future really is with hydrogen cells. zero pollution, instant "recharge" at a fuel station, so basically its a like for like user experience.
we just need to work out how to produce enough hydrogen cheaply enough that its economically viable and doesnt need 75 additional power stations to do it!
I think the root cause for all our issues is cracking nuclear fusion power stations. Once we have that nailed, we can produce enormous numbers of fusion power stations and have enormous amounts of surplus power to do all these lovely eco things and not have to worry about emissions!

but its expensive - or will be - to set up.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top