Gas burner, canister/tubing/fittings advice + availability

Hi,

On a whim I bought one of these a few weeks ago to use with my 50L stock pot, after realising my gas hob in the kitchen can only just manage to boil 15L of wort at a time:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B008 ... em_1p_0_ti

However I am struggling to find both a) clear advice and b) a convenient source for the correct kind of gas canister, regulator, tubing and fittings for this! I don't have any outside storage at my current house, so I'm a bit paranoid about storing this stuff inside the house in case of leakages/fire/explosions/etc so really need to be 110% sure that I'm getting the right kit.

I've read that propane is the best bet as it performs better than butane at lower temperatures. I've also read various conflicting bits of advice regarding CalorGas and whether or not this is overpriced (I've seen canister deposits for CalorGas as high as £35 which seems crazy when you see them stacked high at rubbish tips etc), the downsides to their proprietary fittings, etc, but the availability of advice on the alternatives to CalorGas in the UK is sorely lacking.

I think there is a supplier of gas canisters near my town (York), but I don't have a car, and even if I could get there via some convoluted combination of buses and walking, I'm not convinced it would be a good idea or even feasible to lug both a cast iron gas burner ring there (to ask for their advice) and then lug it back along with a full gas canister :\

So my questions are as follows:

1. What kind of gas canister, regulator, tubing, fittings etc would I need to get this thing up and running?
2. What canister size would be best? At the moment I've averaged 2-3 brews per year, so not something I'm going to be doing too often
3. Which canisters safe to store indoors? Are any of these designs the kind where when they're not in use you can remove the regulator and they self-seal?
4. Is there an online or mail/phone order place where I could order these parts for delivery?

Any advice would be gratefully received!

I use this exact one.

The Malt Miller also sells them here and also sells propane regulators here. The hose for it is here.

My father in law found someones old gas cylinder for me so I took it to a gas place (BOC) to get it exchanged for a full one. I actually use butane (and have a seperate regulator... it is different to a propane one) as I have a calor gas fire aswell and that's stored indoors always. It's safe and doesn't let any gas out unless the regulator is in and its on the on position. You can order gas online, but you would either need to pay a deposit on the bottle or find one like I did. If you can get hold of an actual calor gas cylinder, that would be handy as you can get it refilled anywhere.

Ah, thanks - I'll look at those regulator/hose combos. Do they fit any canister or are there different fittings for Calor Gas vs. alternatives?

I use this regulator its actually 1.5kg/hr rather than the 1kg/hr they say. This burner 3m of this tubing and a couple of Jubilee clips to hold it in place.

The gas bottle is an orange Calor bottle (or should that be red looks more orange to me?)

Jeltz said:

I use this regulator its actually 1.5kg/hr rather than the 1kg/hr they say. This burner 3m of this tubing and a couple of Jubilee clips to hold it in place.

The gas bottle is an orange Calor bottle (or should that be red looks more orange to me?)

Click to expand...

That's exactly what I use.

I have heard that you shouldn't keep Propane gas bottles indoors. Not really sure why as Butane gas bottles are often kept indoors in heaters.

Well yes, the availability of indoor calor gas heaters was the argument I used with my girlfriend... My grandma had a calor gas heater in her kitchen for about 30 years with no ill effects! She's popped her clogs now... (unrelated causes)

Any ideas for why butane can be stored indoors but propane cannot?

I suppose if the canister is being stored indoors the only downside to butane vs. propane (the idea that it doesn't perform as well at lower temperatures) is moot as it will always be at room temperature when taken outside to brew?

I wish we had a shed!

Hi there,

I'm in a similar position to you with my gas burner, I was wondering how you're getting on and if your happy with it?

I have bought the same burner, I happened to have a high pressure reg on 6mm hose. Which sounded and looked like a jet engine! I asked a friend who knows more about gas than I do, which wouldn't be difficult! and he thought I should be using the 37mb 1.5kg reg. So I bought one with 8 mm hose and the flame looks mediocre.

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

If using propane (and I would always choose propane over butane ) then the vast vast vast majority of burners are designed to use a low pressure regulator supplying butane at either 37 or 50 mBar. . . . Under NO circumstances should they be used with a high pressure regulator (1-4Bar), if you attempt this the flame is quite likely to be blown out. The flame may well look weedy, but that is how it should look.

I use one of those burners for my autoclave (pressure canner), and it is being fed from my adjustable (50-150mBar) regulator and works very well. . . . I'm only using that reg as it also feeds my 11Kw burner that I use on my 150L kettle, so I already had it. I was nearly tempted to buy a 37mBar one, but it turned out not to be required.

Hey,

Gordon said:

I have bought the same burner, I happened to have a high pressure reg on 6mm hose. Which sounded and looked like a jet engine! I asked a friend who knows more about gas than I do, which wouldn't be difficult! and he thought I should be using the 37mb 1.5kg reg. So I bought one with 8 mm hose and the flame looks mediocre.

Click to expand...

I'm actually more confused now as I had decided to just pick up a 4.5kg CalorGas Butane cylinder (4.5kg for storage space, butane for safety reasons) but I was just going to get the 29mbar regulator which Calor recommend... but, based on what you're saying, the flames using this regulator will be even less than puny!

Can anyone advise whether or not you can use more beefy regulators than 29mbar on the 4.5kg Butane CalorGas cylinders?

Cheers

As far as I can tell canister size makes no difference.

The canister size does actually make a difference in it's ability to effectively boil the gas inside the cylinder to produce the vapour that you burn. Larger bottles work better than the smaller ones.

Personally I use a 19kg cylinder and that works fine, I think some people use smaller ones, but I'm not sure how small you can go while maintaining the required output.

The larger the cylinder the more cost effective they are as well, so thats as good a reason as any for getting the largest one you can store.

Here is what mine looks like under a 70 litre boiler.

Do_you_realise said:

Can anyone advise whether or not you can use more beefy regulators than 29mbar on the 4.5kg Butane CalorGas cylinders?

Click to expand...

The standard for butane is 29mBar :thumb: . . . Yes the output from a butane system will be less than that for propane

Aleman said:

Do_you_realise said:

Can anyone advise whether or not you can use more beefy regulators than 29mbar on the 4.5kg Butane CalorGas cylinders?

Click to expand...

The standard for butane is 29mBar :thumb: . . . Yes the output from a butane system will be less than that for propane

Click to expand...

Ah, fair enough. If that's the standard, are there higher pressure non-standard regulators you can get for butane...?

The photo probably resembles what I was getting with the low pressure regulator, I was outside in daylight and it just looked weak beside the high pressure, The High pressure reg really was scary sounding and looking, So I am quite glad to see this is what I should expect while brewing, nice and relaxed, without the need for a clean pair of yips at the end!

Does anyone know why these burners are advertised as 7.5KW online but only rated 4.5KW on the box?


Thanks again
Cheers

Gordon said:

Does anyone know why these burners are advertised as 7.5KW online but only rated 4.5KW on the box?

Click to expand...

No! Mine came in a big box with an order of grains and other things. I didn't know that.

Mine brings 37L of water up to mash temp in about 40-45 mins and maintains a rolling boil, so I'm happy with that for now, though I would be concern with doing bigger batches.

I didn't realise that propane was had a higher output. As we're nearly in the summer, I'll get my propane cylinder filled next time instead. Don't need the fire anymore for a while anyway.

Do_you_realise said:

Aleman said:

The standard for butane is 29mBar :thumb: . . . Yes the output from a butane system will be less than that for propane

Click to expand...

Ah, fair enough. If that's the standard, are there higher pressure non-standard regulators you can get for butane...?

Click to expand...

Further to this, as an example, this http://www.leisureshopdirect.com/caravan/gas/product_33631/gok_50mbar_regulator.aspx says it's suitable for 'propane or butane'. Does that mean I can use it on a CalorGas butane cylinder?