Stout - afraid to bottle it - HELP

So..brewed my first ever batch...no recipe...most of the rules ignored...


Wanna bottle now but I am afraid to do it and here is why:


What I used and how:


My pot fits 20 L easily

- dark munich malt 3.487 kg (22ebc)

- black malt 0.225 kg (1500ebc)

- roasted barley 0.675 kg (1450ebc)

- chocolate malt 0.113 kg (1175ebc)

----which gives me 4.5 kg (9.9208 lb) of malt


Yeast : Dry English Ale (WLP007) - 1 pack


Hops: Brewers gold 2015 - 50g at boil, 10g 20 min 'til the end


I used the MAXI BIAB and NO CHILL method to gain 23 L of wort in the primary


I've put water on 80*C (176F), added malt which was room temperature of 21*C(69.8F),

temp went down to 73C (163.4F), stirred after half an hour (temp at 70C/158F),

second stir after one hour (65C/149F), third stir at 63C/145.4F, took the bag out and did a first Sparge with 8 L and a second Sparge with 6 L.


Pre-boil Gravity was 1.048 at 63C/145.4F


Boiled for an hour and a half, adding Sparge water when it evaporated, with hop addition at pre-mentioned times.

Left it over night on a cold tile floor to cool down.


Next day, OG at 25C/77F was 1.034 and I added my single pack of yeast.


After 12 hours it was bubbling like crazy. After 36 hours the bubbles dropped down to one bubble every 4-5 minutes.


After 10 days in a plastic fermenter I decided to do a gravity reading.

It said 1.026 at 20C/68F

48 hours later same thing.


I have sanitised everything...freak on those matters.
Reading through on-line and offline books I've realised I have underpitched yeast.
The taste of it is very nice and there are no off smells.


So, again I did something crazy.

48 hours after second SAME reading on hydrometer I transferred it to a second fermenter,

I took 2 liters of this wort, boiled it, added cca 600-700g !!!! (21-24 oz) of castor sugar and when it cooled to 20C/68F I pitched a new pack of the same yeast.

Waited 24 hours again and pitched that in what I think was Stuck Fermentation Wort.


24 hours later it was bubbling "normally" like I saw on many You-tube videos. and it was doing so for the next 5 days.

I took a reading when it stopped completely (NO BUBBLES WHAT SO EVER) and it said 1.040 at 20C/68F.


Here is the I AM AFRAID part.

From what I read I should wait until the reading goes down to 1.015 or something.

Of course, that is not the issue with beers with high starting gravity but mine is not that.

Or is it?

When I press on the lid of the second fermenter it gives off a lot of bubbles through the airlock and it springs back into place.


Took multiple refractometer readings and hydrometer reading and they are no where near the same.
Wanted to calibrate my refractometer but where I live currently I can not find destilled water.
In the pharmacy when I asked for it the lady sold me sterilised water (did not realise until I got home).


1.Should I bottle...or wait longer...or throw away?
I have no Keg option, only bottles.


2.Should I (and will it make a difference) put it in the basement where the temp is cca
12C/53.6F in the second fermenter and leave more for some time?

3.Should I leave it where it is now for a certain period more?

4.If there is no chance of bottling it, can I drink it as is?
Taste is darn good even without bubbles.
I already made a sourdough starter with some of it and the bread turned out amazing.

First I would say its highly unlikely your current SG is as high as 1.040, after 5/6 days of fermentation and 2 packs of yeast.
Next I would forget the refractometer.
Assuming you know how to read a hydrometer , I would then check the calibration on your hydrometer against clean water at your hydrometer reference temperature and retake the SG and correct it as required. Note the reading, then leave it alone for a day or two.
Then retake SG and if its the same reading and its clearing and it doesn't taste sweet you can bottle, or leave it a little longer if you want it to clear some more. If it is higher than 1.015 I would bottle some of it in PET bottles so you can monitor the carbing.
And if you want to drink it as it is, thats up to you if it tastes OK.

Refractometers don't work after fermenting, the readings need extra recalculation.
Did you run the numbers through an app, like beersmith or biermacht or something like that?

Dude I'm not sure dark munich even has diastatic power and you mashed at 73C? You might be on your own here you renegade! If your fermenter supports it I'd probably seal it up, give it a swirl to resuspend the yeast and leave it somewhere out of the way for a while. Only safe option for bottling here is consistent reads for a while rather than trying to guess where your final gravity is going to end up. That or bottle in PET bottles and keep an eye on them.

@terrym
I did a reading just know and it's at 1.030 at 23C/73.4F.
It tastes ok, even the wifey likes it.
I'll read again tomorrow and bottle if the same numbers come up.

Can I put the bottles in the basement at cca 12C/53.6F and leave them there for a month and more or do they must (Stout, Dry English Ale yeast) stay 2 weeks at room temp?

@GerritT
Did not know that about refractometers.
I did not run it through an app 'cause I did a MAXI Biab and could not find the exact ingredients I used in them.


Thank You both very much for the quick reply!


I

I very much doubt you had a stuck fermentation rather with your very high mash temp you did not have much fermentable sugar
As Terrym says use a few pet bottles so as you can gauge secondary fermentation. Failing that open bottles on a weekly basis

@stz
That explains why most stout recipes call for Maris Otter to be used as base :)
Diastetic power of Dark munich 25*L, Maris Otter 120*L.

Guess it will have to be PET bottles and have to drink it all before a trip to Thailand in February

If you cook use some of it to make Beef in Stout Casserole like I do.
Recipe can be provided if required.

@terrym
Actually, I made a sourdough starter with it the other day and today made first loaf with it
I do cook and do not like to waste anything :)

If it's still in the fermenter, you could dump some champagne yeast in it. That might chew more sugars away without really changing the taste profile.
But damn, mashing at over 70º... that's high for regular mash...

I don't think I'd want it to ferment out with 22% of the malt being dark roast. Plus 50g of hops, boiled for an hour and a half will be pretty bitter too. It might need all that unfermented sugar for balance.

Chalk it up to experience. You say it tastes good, the wife likes it, it might not be the beer you wanted to make, but you made beer. Messing with it at this point is just a further chance to make it worse. Drink it, brew more often, get better at brewing. The diastatic power thing, yeah getting that right is a thing. You didn't have enough enzymes present to begin with and the mash temperature was way high. You were on the right path with a decently long mash, but I wouldn't rely on losing heat during the mash as the enzymes are denatured almost immediately at higher temperatures. Even at 65C b-amylase gets only 15 minutes or so to work. They don't start working again once it cools down.

What I did now is I roused the secondary fermenter and it started to bubble again.
I'll see for how long that goes and if it helps to get it down by at least a point, I'll keep doing that until I come somewhere below 1.015.
Other option I am prepared to do is bottle it in PET bottles and then closely monitor it.

Melver said:

What I did now is I roused the secondary fermenter and it started to bubble again.
I'll see for how long that goes and if it helps to get it down by at least a point, I'll keep doing that until I come somewhere below 1.015.
Other option I am prepared to do is bottle it in PET bottles and then closely monitor it.

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That might not necessarily be a sign of life and more CO2 just being forced out. With all the unfermentables etc (others have already covered it) I would just give as much time as you can. That way make sure it has gone as far as it will and either use PET bottles or a pressure barrel with a release valve on top.

Did you know that you can make your own distilled water. Boil water, using something to collect the steam which when cool turns back to water

A few thoughts to add:
1. Yes, distilled water is ideal, but I wouldn't worry about tap water (instead of distilled) as a hydrometer check - it is close. See https://www.simetric.co.uk/si_water.htm Note that the density is more sensitive to temperature. Hydrometers are calibrated for a given temperature (usually 20 C, I think).
2. As well as PET bottles you would be safe (i.e. have pressure relief) with swing top bottles. You will be less safe if you have to glug 20L of strong Belgian beer in a hurry to get the empty bottles.
3. I like the idea of making bread with it but am surprised that the right bacteria are present. Perhaps the lactobacillus you need for the bread starter culture are present in the beer?

As others said, if it tastes good you have a success.

Melver said:

I'll keep doing that until I come somewhere below 1.015.

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That will not happen for all the reasons explained by @stz. Bottle soon before you introduce an infection from interfering with it. Enjoy your beer and learn for next time.

If it tastes good. It is good.