brewing stout - how short can you go?

Robbo851 · Jan 23, 2019

Hi,
To up The ABV and IBU on past IPA kits I have brewed short from the recommended 23 L to 20L. No problems came out as I wanted stronger and fuller flavor. I am now about to start a Chocmeister Kit from Wilko which I will be adding raspberries and Lactose to make a chocolate raspberry milk stout.
To make this stronger I was going to brew short (also don't have loads of bottles left and don't really want 40 550 ml bottles of stout as I wont drink loads of it in the summer like I would an IPA or pale).
would 16L be too short? 17 or 18L better?

Davewhit · Jan 23, 2019

Looking forward to these replies as Im fancying a stout next.

beertrap · Jan 23, 2019

You can brew short, but if it's a high abv beer like above 8, consider adding some DME to boost the abv. Strong stouts age well and it might be quite nice in november. Ha wing a few extra bottles ageing in the cellar has always been a good thing for me.

Otherwise, cut back a liter or 2.

Robbo851 · Jan 23, 2019

beertrap said:
You can brew short, but if it's a high abv beer like above 8, consider adding some DME to boost the abv. Strong stouts age well and it might be quite nice in november. Ha wing a few extra bottles ageing in the cellar has always been a good thing for me.

Otherwise, cut back a liter or 2.

one of the issues is the lack of bottles - garage is full of past IPAs and pales and its not like ill be stopping after the stout!

im happy if the ABV goes to 8, 9 or 10 probably don't want it much over 10- ideal would be about 8.5

following their kit and brew to 23L says approx. 4%

terrym · Jan 23, 2019

1. I always brew my Coopers stouts to 19 litres and use GS, coffee, dark muscavado, dark DME and now chocolate malt if its any help.
2. And there's plenty of ideas for pimping the Coopers kits in the kit review section, but I'd steer of dumping in lots of lots of black treacle unless you really like the stuff.
3. Someone on here didn't think much of the Chocmeister kit even though he brewed it with DME instead of sugar.Thought it was thin.

beertrap · Jan 23, 2019

What's the recipe?

Robbo851 · Jan 23, 2019

terrym said:
1. I always brew my Coopers stouts to 19 litres and use GS, coffee, dark muscavado, dark DME and now chocolate malt if its any help.
2. And there's plenty of ideas for pimping the Coopers kits in the kit review section, but I'd steer of dumping in lots of lots of black treacle unless you really like the stuff.
3. Someone on here didn't think much of the Chocmeister kit even though he brewed it with DME instead of sugar.Thought it was thin.

what ABV does it usually come out at?

I'm happy with how I'm pimping the kit just wondering how short I can go.

The possible thinness is one of the reasons for brewing this as short as possible

Robbo851 · Jan 23, 2019

terrym said:
1. I always brew my Coopers stouts to 19 litres and use GS, coffee, dark muscavado, dark DME and now chocolate malt if its any help.
2. And there's plenty of ideas for pimping the Coopers kits in the kit review section, but I'd steer of dumping in lots of lots of black treacle unless you really like the stuff.
3. Someone on here didn't think much of the Chocmeister kit even though he brewed it with DME instead of sugar.Thought it was thin.

also not a treacle fan so wont be doing that, where do you get your chocolate malt from and what form is it in ? extract or do you boil it?

Smileyr8 · Jan 23, 2019

Robbo851 said:
what ABV does it usually come out at?

I'm happy with how I'm pimping the kit just wondering how short I can go.

The possible thinness is one of the reasons for brewing this as short as possible

I suspect you could go down to 12 ltrs or even a little further as long as the yeast is upto the job.

SmallSpacesBrewing · Jan 23, 2019

I would be careful going to short. These kits are made for (prehopped) 20-23 liters
I brewed a kit short down to 12liters once (Danish lager) and it came out 10 times more bitter than a double IPA.

Robbo851 · Jan 23, 2019

Thanks, i'll think ill go down to 17l - I have ran out of decent yeast so will have to go with what was in the kit -

Gulpitdarn · Jan 23, 2019

Davewhit said:
Looking forward to these replies as Im fancying a stout next.

If your thinking of using a Wilko kit also, then I can recommend the Wilko Velvet Stout adding 500g dark brown muscovardo sugar and 500g medium DME brewing short to 20L Tesco spring water. My result was a very lovely thick beer. No idea of the alcohol percentage as I did not have a hydrometer then, but at a guess I'd say it's four and a half to five per cent, just double the sugar if you want more alcohol in it.

terrym · Jan 23, 2019

Robbo851 said:
what ABV does it usually come out at?

OGs usually about 1.047, FGs about 1.012, which works out at about 4.5-5% which is enough for me.
Use this to calculate ABV etc and for kits use extract method. Its quite accurate for OG for kits and extract brews, but FG is mostly yeast dependant although you will not be too far out.
http://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/calculator/

Robbo851 said:
also not a treacle fan so wont be doing that, where do you get your chocolate malt from and what form is it in ? extract or do you boil it?

I buy mine online from The Homebrew Company when I order other stuff. Any good LHBS should stock it. I buy mine as a crushed grain. You don't boil grains like this and crystal malt. If you have no other grains to mash you just steep the grain alone in hot water (say about 65-70*C) for about 30 mins, filter off the liquor , sparge the grains to remove the last of the dissolvables, then boil the collected liquor for about 15-20 minutes to sterilise, cool then add to the wort.

My standard recipe is now 1 Coopers kit can ( I prefer the Irish) and the kit yeast, 500g DME, 500g Golden Syrup, 125g dark muscavado sugar, 4 shots strong coffee (not instant!), and 190g chocolate malt.

Finally if you brew a kit shorter and shorter you not only concentrate the flavours but you also concentrate the IBUs, so go carefully.

Robbo851 · Jan 24, 2019

thanks for the replies, as I drink quite a lot of imperial stout and Russian Stranniks and DIPPAS I'm pretty sure I can handle and like High IBU and ABV.

also sod calculators just get the ABV calculator app - as they say there's an app for that but thanks anyway.

Roger Wilko · Jan 24, 2019

I have just bottled my chocmeister at the weekend. Started at 1051 and finish 1012 so around 5%. I brewed short to 18 ltrs with 1kg brew enhancer and 250 gr of brewing sugar. Tasted really nice when bottling, a nice chocolate under tone

Robbo851 · Jan 24, 2019

Roger Wilko said:
I have just bottled my chocmeister at the weekend. Started at 1051 and finish 1012 so around 5%. I brewed short to 18 ltrs with 1kg brew enhancer and 250 gr of brewing sugar. Tasted really nice when bottling, a nice chocolate under tone

thanks, great to hear from someone who has done the same kit, surprised going 5L under has only pushed it up to just over 5% .

I will go to 17L and add 1 kg of brewing sugar. 550g of frozen raspberries and 500g of lactose (would add more lactose but its all I have left).

Davewhit · Jan 24, 2019

I'm loving sound of raspberry milk stout. This may be my next brew. Do you have to use full fruits or would syrup give same well similar rusults?
Dave

Robbo851 · Jan 24, 2019

Davewhit said:
I'm loving sound of raspberry milk stout. This may be my next brew. Do you have to use full fruits or would syrup give same well similar rusults?
Dave

syrup would give a much more intense flavor and if it had any sugar in it then it would ferment. use frozen its super easy. Get a muslin bag and put it in boiling water to sterilize it, add a bag of frozen raspberries, Lidl sell 500g bags for £2.19 and as its frozen there is little risk of wild yeast or anything that would cause infection. I add normally around day 7 of fermentation so there is already alcohol present.

Davewhit · Jan 24, 2019

That's that then fruits in a muslin bag it is. The reason I thought syrup is as I thought fruit would just go to pulp. Never even thought of containing it in a bag ha.... what a ....
thanks for advise.
Is it couple of weeks at least in fv then as it's a stout guessing pressure barrel would be fine?

Robbo851 · Jan 24, 2019

I normally follow 2+2+2 but as its a stout I will do 3 +3+3
so 3 weeks FV (add fruit at end of first week)
3 weeks bottle in warm place
3 weeks bottle in cold place
drink and enjoy

if you have Instagram you can see some of my previous brews using #bemorebearaware or on untapped bear aware brewing

got a peach and raspberry IPA ready at the weekend.

brewing stout - how short can you go?

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