CAMRA at it again

[MickDundee]

I do agree with most of the principles of what CAMRA is trying to achieve but not the fundamentalism.
A softer line would win them more influence and credibility, I think.

I actually appreciate that they are trying to keep cask ale going (hence why I follow them on social media), but they definitely need to take one foot out of the past when it comes to both the use of CO2 to preserve casks and the recent craft beer boom. As a result they are alienating real ale drinkers in their 30s (who also align to the craft beer scene as well as enjoying traditional British styles) like me, and making themselves a bit of a laughing stick.

 

[An Ankoù]

High time CAMRA threw in the towel, in my opinion. They're stuck in the 70's and 80's where they did some good in breaking a monopoly, but they haven't really moved on. Beer, on the other hand, has moved on. Cask ale is a unique drink, which ought to be taken out of the hands of the bumbling, superannuated gammon which is CAMRA and given a position on UNESCO's Intangible Cultural Heritage List. I was a member for decades and now that I'm better away of their political stance, I regret every minute.

 

[peebee]

What CAMRA forget in their diehard anti-CO2 ways ...

Is CO2 is essential to stun the casks before sending them on for slaughter ...


( Am I mixing me facts up again?).

 

[CD]

CAMRA bashing may be all the rage these days, but we shouldn’t forget that in the early seventies (when I joined) they were responsible for enlightening people on the different methods of beer dispense, and at a time when breweries kept the strength of their beers a secret, getting their OG’s – and then ABVs -known to the public. They taught my generation a lot about beer, and I have fond memories of many Camra-run Beer Festivals.

Of course things went **** up when they decided cask breathers were an enemy, not a friend, and started using the worst excesses of the Wine boors to describe a beer.

 

[user 43495]

I was a CAMRA member and also served on my local branch committee. That was back in 1979 and it was a political orgainisation even way back then. I resigned my membership in the early 1980s. I don't think they really know much about beer, brewing and cellar management. If they did, they would understand that a lot of so-called real ale is under what is referred to by some as a 'backup air supply', which basically means the cask beer is protected from the air by a blanket pressure of co2, delivered via the shive hole in the cask. The way they promote expensive bland beers just because the pub uses a handpump to dispense them is, in my view, demonstrative of their obsession.

 

[user 43495]

CAMRA bashing may be all the rage these days, but we shouldn’t forget that in the early seventies (when I joined) they were responsible for enlightening people on the different methods of beer dispense, and at a time when breweries kept the strength of their beers a secret, getting their OG’s – and then ABVs -known to the public. They taught my generation a lot about beer, and I have fond memories of many Camra-run Beer Festivals.

Of course things went **** up when they decided cask breathers were an enemy, not a friend, and started using the worst excesses of the Wine boors to describe a beer.

I have been CAMRA bashing for decades; the reason is they, like so many other pressure groups (sic) became political. Originally they were a very successful consumer group and mabe their earlier methods should be used today for changing a few other things. Certainly I remember when you didn't go into Birmigham if you wanted an interesting beer; they were almost all M&B or Ansell's tied houses. Davenport's had only a tiny representation there. A cask beer was a rarity, while my then local in Stourbridge served Ansell's on proper draught and their mild was lovely. Not so in Brum. However their 'educational' prowess became a matter of narrow-minded and uninformed dogma. I ran a pub for a time and on one evening had a visit from a local CAMRA rep. He spent ages asking me about the pub's facilities for the disabled (a worthy cause I'm sure) but I had always thought they should be interested in the beers. When I took the pub over, all the beer was keg. I introduced cask beers to the place but he wasn't even interested. I pointed out to him that for over 20 minutes he'd been asking all these irrelevant questions and what about the beer? I gave him a free glass of one of the cask beers but he didn't want to talk about any of that. I have no time for them and haven't had for decades.

 

[user 43495]

Many places do not sell enough real ale and so the real ale they sell is old, stale and not enjoyable. I stayed at an upmarket pub b&b recently, it was excellent in all aspects except the beer. I switched to keg after tasting the beer on handpump, and - a first for me - I was served a pint of cloudy keg. I was told that all barrels are slightly different and that the cloudiness did not affect the taste - keg beer I remind you. The pub was cask marque accredited.

And most real ale is 'undistinguished'. Certainly not worth the 5 quid or whatever it costs. I used to so love going to pubs but lost interest many years ago. They have become such anti-social places with unwanted piped pop 'music' blaring out, and you can't smoke your pipe!

 

[user 43495]

I too am struggling to understand the problem with this statement. Camera's MO is to get more people to drink cask ale, nowt wrong with that is there, and if more beer was hand pumped as opposed to pushed out with CO2 surely the demand for CO2 would drop?

It depends on the beers, many of which are so bland. And they are almost always heavily over-priced.

 

[user 43495]

What is it that you find wrong with this? It is factually correct.

It is wrong because of the widespread need for a blanket co2 pressure to be applied to casks. This need may possibly be due to many customers in pubs wanting so many different drinks and therefore a cask beer cannot be guaranteed to survive the time it takes for it to become empty. Many pubs deliberately aim their marketing at the very young who are perhaps keener on designer drinks rather than those of the type we like to brew and drink.

 

[user 43495]

View attachment 54628

To paraphrase - the CO2 shortage is a risk to pubs and breweries when many are already in the brink, but if everyone just drank cask ale it wouldn’t be a problem.

They are rightfully getting pelters on Facebook over this, but their diehards are still desperate to defend them.

Camra dwell in la-la land.

 

[user 43495]

It's correct if the only use a brewery had for CO2 was carbing keg beer. It is used in various cleaning and bottling processes too. I spoke to the warehouse manager of a large, traditional brewery today whose own production is 80% cask and who are currently getting a third of the CO2 they need to operate. CAMRA's statement was opportunistic and betrayed a lack of understanding of the industry they claim to defend.

That's usually the trouble with campaign/pressure groups. They fulfilled their desire decades ago but they can't bear to hang up their slogan-riven hats.

 

[user 43495]

CAMRA seems to be one of the strangest organisations on the planet, an absolute gift for Viz writers. But, in this instance, I don't see what's wrong with pointing out that naturally conditioned ale makes sense and is a way around the crisis which can actually help the struggling pub and brewing industries? Even if it appears opportunistic, it's true and potentially helpful, surely? It seems a bit mad that a drink that creates its own co2 is routinely force carbonated. Regardless of shortages. Sustainable practices needed establishing and encouraging, which is what is happening here I think?

The one thing I note with some amusement is how the modern world calls every minor problem a 'crisis' yet cheerfully ignores situations which more worthy of the name. eg a few wadlling folk = obesity crisis, yet our homeless veterans are ignored while hotel accommodation is freely given to - shall we say - undocumented visitors. Cask beers can only help the pub business if people buy them. Personally I wouldn't pay 5 quid for 90% of so-called real ales. They are almost always bland, and sweet, presumably to appeal to the kids and disguise their lack of flavours. Left to sour in the cask they don't help anyone. However it's just as difficult to get many drinkers to appreciate true quality beers as it is to get 98% of the population to appreciate true quality music.

 

[user 43495]

I do agree with most of the principles of what CAMRA is trying to achieve but not the fundamentalism.
A softer line would win them more influence and credibility, I think.
[/QUOTE

CAMRA had achieved what they set out to do by the end of the 1970s, yet they are still there finding trendy causes to bang on about. Personally I find them a depressing nuisance.

 

[marshbrewer]

Personally I wouldn't pay 5 quid for 90% of so-called real ales. They are almost always bland, and sweet, presumably to appeal to the kids and disguise their lack of flavours.

I've no idea where you drink, but that doesn't describe the real ales in my boozer.

 

[Sadfield]

I've no idea where you drink, but that doesn't describe the real ales in my boozer.

Same, and I don't recognise the real ale drinkers. Kids? That well known Camra demographic. Ticking must be the new Pokemon. Gotta Cask Them All!

 

[user 43495]

I've no idea where you drink, but that doesn't describe the real ales in my boozer.

Let me tell you then: I drink my own at home.

 

[Paul Bennett]

The one thing I note with some amusement is how the modern world calls every minor problem a 'crisis' yet cheerfully ignores situations which more worthy of the name. eg a few wadlling folk = obesity crisis, yet our homeless veterans are ignored while hotel accommodation is freely given to - shall we say - undocumented visitors. Cask beers can only help the pub business if people buy them. Personally I wouldn't pay 5 quid for 90% of so-called real ales. They are almost always bland, and sweet, presumably to appeal to the kids and disguise their lack of flavours. Left to sour in the cask they don't help anyone. However it's just as difficult to get many drinkers to appreciate true quality beers as it is to get 98% of the population to appreciate true quality music.

This is a very strange post. It's fine not to appreciate real ale but I'd have to disagree with virtually every point made.
Real ale isn't trying to appeal specifically to kids. Most of it isn't sweet or lack flavour and it's rarely more than a fiver.
The reference to refugees is just a bit weird as well. Maybe a UKIP style joke but actually just a cheap shot.
My suggestion is to go to a traditional boozer which specialises in Ale. Maybe that would be an education. If you'd prefer to quaff cheap lager when you go out you are well catered for in most High Streets and you'll probably get a breakfast for a fiver as well.

 

[Andrew Booth]

One of the downsides to brewing your own beers to your own tastes is that I am loath to spend my hard earned cash on Supermarket or supposed real ale in pubs. Camra in my opinion has served its purpose and has had its time. Modern methods of kegging these days are far superior to what was around 40 50 years ago.

 

[Hanglow]

It's a shame they couldn't build on their earlier success, they could have championed good beer in general but for some bizarre reason decided not to. Shame, a vast missed opportunity.

 

[Andrew Booth]

A missed opportunity indeed. In a lot of ways I think they forgot the reason Camra was formed in the first place.