Co-pitching in a witbier?

[Jim Brewster]

Did a witbier at the weekend and in short, I didn't have enough T-58 left over in the pack from a previous brew. I don't intend to use that yeast again any time soon so don't want to buy another pack. Could've built a starter if I'd known but not having much time I pitched and within 12 hours it had signs of life. Krausen is now there but quite minimal so wondering if I could finish it off using another yeast once the first wave is finished? I have packs of US-05, M-29 Saison and M-20 wheat beer. Leaning towards the Saison to finish off whatever fermentables might be left and also give some Saison yeast character, but the US-05 is an option too. Does that sound OK?

The issue was I guessed using about "half a pack" of T-58 dry yeast last time and kept the rest back in the fridge, but discovered the other "half" was in fact only about 2 grams! So quite a bit of an underpitch for the small batch.

This was the recipe for info. 5L batch. Experimented with leaving out orange peel and substituting with a citra late addition instead, and upped the coriander, because I quite like it.
425g Pilsner malt
400g flaked wheat
25g oats
BIAB - mashed 20mins@50C, 60mins@68C, raised to 78C "mash out"
60 minute boil
5g Saaz @60mins
2g Citra @60mins
4g crushed coriander seed @5mins
1 crushed green cardamom pod + seeds @5mins
2g Citra @80C for 20 mins
Aiming for just under 4% ABV and 25 IBU

 

[An Ankoù]

Did a witbier at the weekend and in short, I didn't have enough T-58 left over in the pack from a previous brew. I don't intend to use that yeast again any time soon so don't want to buy another pack. Could've built a starter if I'd known but not having much time I pitched and within 12 hours it had signs of life. Krausen is now there but quite minimal so wondering if I could finish it off using another yeast once the first wave is finished? I have packs of US-05, M-29 Saison and M-20 wheat beer. Leaning towards the Saison to finish off whatever fermentables might be left and also give some Saison yeast character, but the US-05 is an option too. Does that sound OK?

The issue was I guessed using about "half a pack" of T-58 dry yeast last time and kept the rest back in the fridge, but discovered the other "half" was in fact only about 2 grams! So quite a bit of an underpitch for the small batch.

This was the recipe for info. 5L batch. Experimented with leaving out orange peel and substituting with a citra late addition instead, and upped the coriander, because I quite like it.
425g Pilsner malt
400g flaked wheat
25g oats
BIAB - mashed 20mins@50C, 60mins@68C, raised to 78C "mash out"
60 minute boil
5g Saaz @60mins
2g Citra @60mins
4g crushed coriander seed @5mins
1 crushed green cardamom pod + seeds @5mins
2g Citra @80C for 20 mins
Aiming for just under 4% ABV and 25 IBU

A 10g pack is considered to be sufficient for a 23 litre batch so it's not that much of an underpitch to use 2 g in a 5 litre batch. Did you weigh the yeast and discover you only had 2 grams? I think I'd warm it up a bit and see how it goes.

 

[Jim Brewster]

Yes I plonked the sachet on the scales and it came to 3 grams including the packet. True, it's not that much of an underpitch and I might get away with it but the krausen is much less than anticipated. Wait and see really but this will be a back up plan.

 

[clib]

The M20 wheat is a pretty good option, I'd say, for a wit. That, or finishing off with M29.

 

[dad_of_jon]

m20 is bavarian weiss yeast, m21 is belgian wit yeast. I notice a difference using them: erdinger vs hoegaarden/blue moon. granted I add 2 litres of orange juice to the wit, but only that and the yeast differ and everything else in the recipe is the same. they are both great styles but m21 is my goto for a wit beer if using dried yeast.

 

[clib]

m20 is bavarian weiss yeast, m21 is belgian wit yeast. I notice a difference using them: erdinger vs hoegaarden/blue moon. granted I add 2 litres of orange juice to the wit, but only that and the yeast differ and everything else in the recipe is the same. they are both great styles but m21 is my goto for a wit beer if using dried yeast.

True but I think M20 would work, I've used it a few times, and M21 isn't one of the options.

 

[phillc]

I have no experience with the Mangrove Jack's M21, but from experience the M20 is one of the better dry yeasts for imparting banana esters in wheat beer, especially if fermented at 20c+. If that sounds good to you, use it

 

[clib]

I have no experience with the Mangrove Jack's M21, but from experience the M20 is one of the better dry yeasts for imparting banana esters in wheat beer, especially if fermented at 20c+. If that sounds good to you, use it

There is some banana but not loads. I've got banana from M31 in a recent batch, but it is diminishing with time. Still there though.

 

[Jim Brewster]

To follow this up.. I saw a video on cofermentation that said most of the yeast flavours are developed in the first 48 hours, which had already passed, so I figured I might as well use a neutral yeast and so built up a small starter from a few grams of US-05 just using table sugar and tipped it in a few days into fermentation just to make sure, seemed to cause an increase in activity for a day or two.

...bottled today and had a little sip and it was pretty good, lots of yeast flavours and more so than the last time I used T-58 so its possible the lower pitch rate helped with that, it's looking promising anyway.