Getting cherry flavour into beer

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BlackRegent

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I've recently brewed a cherry chocolate porter and for the cherry flavour I fermented the beer in secondary with this product...


I chose it as it claims to be 90% fruit puree with 10% sugar and no added nasties.

I came to keg the beer yesterday and drank the hyrdrometer sample and I can detect no cherry flavour at all! Or at least none of the rich, black forest and marzipan type flavours I was expecting. If there is anything there, it is very very feint.

I'm thinking of adding some cherry flavouring, but the flavourings on Amazon seem to get very mixed reviews and I would rather leave it as a nice chocolate porter, rather than add a synthetic cherry top note.

Does anyone have a tried and tested cherry flavouring product? Now it's in the keg, I don't want to faff around putting it back on fruit, hence why I want to use a good quality flavouring.
 

MickDundee

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It might just be the fact it’s a stout so the dark malts will mask the fruit and you need to add more. I’ve used the Carte D’Or and Leonce Blanc raspberry purées (which are also 90% fruit and 10% sugar) in a couple of Berlinerweisse/Catharina Sour beers which have been very pale and only around 4.2-4.5% ABV and it’s worked very well.
 

F00b4r

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Was that 1kg of cherries in a 20L batch? If so probably nowhere near enough, IIRC correctly you need to be looking at about 4-5 times that amount (see sour cherries — The Yeast Bay for an award winning beer and the amount used). You need access to a cherry tree or grab them when there is a glut and they are really cheap, either that or be prepared for a very expensive beer.
 
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Was that 1kg of cherries in a 20L batch? If so probably nowhere near enough, IIRC correctly you need to be looking at about 4-5 times that amount (see sour cherries — The Yeast Bay for an award winning beer and the amount used). You need access to a cherry tree or grab them when there is a glut and they are really cheap, either that or be prepared for a very expensive beer.
I have a cherry tree and I’m never quicker than the birds at getting them as they get ripe 😡
 

F00b4r

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I have a cherry tree and I’m never quicker than the birds at getting them as they get ripe 😡

You have to be quick! My in-laws have 3 (sour, sweet and semi-sour) but in the last 3 years there were two terrible harvests and one year when they and us were away and they were all rotten/eaten by the time we got back. :(
I am crossing my fingers for this year!
 

Brew_DD2

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It might just be the fact it’s a stout so the dark malts will mask the fruit and you need to add more. I’ve used the Carte D’Or and Leonce Blanc raspberry purées (which are also 90% fruit and 10% sugar) in a couple of Berlinerweisse/Catharina Sour beers which have been very pale and only around 4.2-4.5% ABV and it’s worked very well.

They're really nice quality purées imo. I'm with Foob4r on this. Sounds like you need more in there.
 
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I have a cherry tree and I’m never quicker than the birds at getting them as they get ripe 😡
SWMBO and I love cherries so it was with some disappointment that we saw the average price in France was about €17 a kilo in the shops!

Out cycling one day, we saw a sign that said “Cerises €5 le kilo” and pulled into the farmyard.

The lady in charge was very nice and helpful until she said “C'est ton arbre là-bas !” (*) and handed us a basket and ladder each!

We picked just under 5 kilos between us; and ate most of them before the day was out.
:D

Delicious!
:hat:

(*) “That’s your tree over there!”
 

raymondo

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I've recently brewed a cherry chocolate porter and for the cherry flavour I fermented the beer in secondary with this product...


I chose it as it claims to be 90% fruit puree with 10% sugar and no added nasties.

I came to keg the beer yesterday and drank the hyrdrometer sample and I can detect no cherry flavour at all! Or at least none of the rich, black forest and marzipan type flavours I was expecting. If there is anything there, it is very very feint.

I'm thinking of adding some cherry flavouring, but the flavourings on Amazon seem to get very mixed reviews and I would rather leave it as a nice chocolate porter, rather than add a synthetic cherry top note.

Does anyone have a tried and tested cherry flavouring product? Now it's in the keg, I don't want to faff around putting it back on fruit, hence why I want to use a good quality flavouring.
I tried exactly the same method - and it is an expensive product - and found the same result. Following this post with interest.
 

BlackRegent

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Thanks everyone for the helpful input. I've ordered some LorAnn flavourings in both cherry and black cherry. It's the brand stocked by Malt Miller so I figured that was some kind of endorsement, although it is cheaper on eBay. I've also bought some of the Lowicz cherry cordial as the local Tesco had some. I plan on doing a bit of a taste test using samples of the beer and a pipette.

What's the recommended dose rate for the Lowicz cherry cordial?

I know I will need to wait for the sugars to ferment out. @Dutto @the baron
 
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FWIW traditional Belgian krieks use daft amounts (like up to 400g/l = 8kg in 20litres !!!) of the old Schaarbeek variety, which is mostly pip with not much flesh.

From what I've read, neither sweet nor Morello cherries are an exact match to Schaarbeeks, but a mix of the two works quite well, I don't know if you can get equivalent purées or other derivatives.

Edit: But you don't need quite as daft amounts of cherries with more "normal" flesh:pip, you might well need 200g/l though. No idea how that translates to purées etc.
 
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F00b4r

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They are a lot more precise on the continent about the type of cherry used (in food), it’s almost always described as sweet, sour or semi sweet/sour. Generic cherry doesn’t seem to cut it as a description.
 

Agentgonzo

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It does depend on the individual fruit, raspberries require a lot less than cherries. That is going to be super intense, could be great though!
You're right. This is prior to bottling, but I think there is too much raspberry and not enough beer
 

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