Grains for Mini Mashes

[Smileyr8]

Right I am looking to make the move to all grain but before doing so I plan on using my last 3 kits up, I am going to do mini mashes with each.

The kits are Coopers Stout, Coopers APA and John Bull Traditional Ale.

I plan to order 10kg of Maris Otter but would like some thoughts on what other malted grain to add to the kits above to enhance them and make them better.

With the grain that left after that I plan to make a golden ale so suggestions for that would also be appreciated.

 

[MyQul]

Stout - crystal, , chocolate, roasted barley if you like your stouts particularly roasty like I do

APA - justt the MO or maybe a wee bit of crystal

John Bull - Crystal

 

[HarrowBrewer]

You might find something on here:
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=55390

 

[clibit]

As above. But the Coopers APA is a blank canvas. You could convert it into anything with different grains. I would probably just add caramalt though, and go hoppy. Get some nice hops.

I wouldn't overdo the grains with the stout. Small amounts, roast barley, crystal, chocolate, any or all of those three malts.

With the traditional ale, bit trickier perhaps. A little crystal, but it will contain crystal already. Maybe a little chocolate, make it more a brown ale/porter.

But adding Maris Otter to each would be enough - they will all benefit a lot from mashing some base malt. I would add hops when you boil the wort for the APA and the Trad Ale, for the last 5 to 10 minutes. The stout won't really need added hops - but you could chuck a handful in.

 

[Smileyr8]

Thanks everybody for the suggestions after reading the suggestions I decided on the below.

Maris Otter 10Kg
Extra Low Crystal (Caramalt) - Crushed 500g 25 EBC
CHATEAU BISCUIT (Biscuit Malt) 50 EBC 500g
Admiral Pellets 100g
Polaris Pellet 100g

Plan to go down this route:-
Coopers Stout + 1.5kg Maris Otter + 250gr Biscuit Malt + 165gr Caramalt + Hops to be decided
Coopers APA + 2kg Maris Otter + 170gr Caramalt + Hops to be decided
John Bull Traditional Ale + 1.5kg Maris Otter + 250gr Biscuit Malt + 165gr Caramalt + Hops to be decided

Does the above sound reasonable so far and are the grains at this rate a rough swap for the kilo of sugar/enhancer/spray malt?

Probably looking at doing a SMASH with the remaining MO will probably order some more hops.

 

[clibit]

That all looks fine. Yes, the grain should provide a similar OG. Do pick up some choc malt and roast barley at some point.

 

[Smileyr8]

That all looks fine. Yes, the grain should provide a similar OG. Do pick up some choc malt and roast barley at some point.

I plan to moving forward, I have 4 cornies (my kegerator holds 3 + the CO2) & the aim is to have a Bitter, Stout and a Pale Ale on the go at all times and develop recipes until I find something that suits, I will also probably brew some stronger ales RIS's, DIPA's and maybe Barley Wine and bottle those.

I currently don't have a grinder so have had to buy the grain pre crushed so did not want to go overboard and end up with stale grain.

 

[MyQul]

I currently don't have a grinder so have had to buy the grain pre crushed so did not want to go overboard and end up with stale grain.

Black, roasted barley and choccy have been kilned to death so don't have much moisture (if any at all) in them so last for absolutely ages

 

[Covrich]

Is it fair to maybe say if you're doing a partial mash with a kit you are probably looking to "mostly" mash the remainder of the fermentables, whereas if you are doing a partrial mash with plain extract you are probably going to mash the grain of the style of recipe too and some fermentables?? have I got that wrong I only ever did partials with extract.

 

[Smileyr8]

Black, roasted barley and choccy have been kilned to death so don't have much moisture (if any at all) in them so last for absolutely ages

Thanks for pointing that out, I was just aware that crushed grain had a shelf life and that it was not overly long.

 

[Smileyr8]

Is it fair to maybe say if you're doing a partial mash with a kit you are probably looking to "mostly" mash the remainder of the fermentables, whereas if you are doing a partrial mash with plain extract you are probably going to mash the grain of the style of recipe too and some fermentables?? have I got that wrong I only ever did partials with extract.

Yes I am looking to replace all the sugar/enhancer/spray malt with grain, the kits will already contain malt from other grains as well as hops, whereas extract is just pale malt I believe so would require a more complex grain bill to achieve a desired beer style.

 

[clibit]

With a kit you only need to use pale malt. The flavours are in the kit. However, people do use roasted grains with kits to enhance the flavours and you can change the style even. With a bland pale kit you can make it into a stout with roast barley, for example. Or a porter, with chocolate and crystal. Treat the kit like extract with some bitterness, in effect. If the kit is not bland, you need to be careful adding roasted grains, or you can end up with too much of a particular flavour, such as an overpowering crystal sweetness. You need to know the kit to be able to tweak it.

 

[Smileyr8]

Do pick up some choc malt and roast barley at some point.

Chocolate Malt and Roasted Barley ordered (had to substitute Polaris hops and ended up with Brambling Cross, not that I mind that, I like Brambling Cross), think I am going to look at tweaking what I previously suggested.

 

[Smileyr8]

Well this weekends brew will be as follows

Coopers Stout 1.7kg

1.5kg Maris Otter 78%
150gr Biscuit Malt 7.8%
125gr Caramalt 6.4%
100gr Roasted Barley 5.2%
50gr Chocolate Max 2.6%

Mash @ 67 degs C for 60 mins

Hops 25gr Brambling Cross Last 7 minutes

Plan to brew it to 20 litres to finish up with 19 litres for the keg.

How does this sound?
Another question I have is this when I boil the wort does it need a 60 minutes boil or could I just bring to the boil and the add the hops and boil for the 7 minutes or does the 60 minute boil have a function?

 

[clibit]

You need to boil longer. At least 30 mins, 45 better. 60 best.

 

[MyQul]

The boil stanitises the wort (so you need at least 15mins), drives off unwanted compounds like DMS (and off flavour) and also you need the boil for 60 mins to aid in shelf life once packaged (although I'm not exactly sure how this works, it's just something I've read)

 

[Smileyr8]

Right its on and the adventure has begun, OG = 1044, the wort tasted beaut ended up with 21 litres repitched the yeast from a previous brew.

71.91% Efficiency acording to http://www.brewersfriend.com/brewhouse-efficiency/ not sure if thats good or not I used dark liquid malt to calculate the kit.

 

[Spapro]

Your journey to the dark side has officially begun !

Clibit started me on partial mashes, head and shoulders above just kits, no more home brew twang and no going back to straight kits.

One thing leads to another though, I was planning to stick with partial mashes with my 15l stockpot on the hob but have recently moved to full BIAB brewing. Still have some kits to work through so will still do a bit of partial mashing with half bags of grain left over from full length brews.

Good luck with your Stout brew, recipe looks good - what starting gravity did you have in your FV out of interest ?

 

[Smileyr8]

Good luck with your Stout brew, recipe looks good - what starting gravity did you have in your FV out of interest ?

The starting gravity OG was 1044, if I can get it down to 1010 that will give me 4.5% in the Corny which is about what I was aiming for.

 

[Smileyr8]

Next mini mash escapade:-

John Bull Traditional Ale
1.6Kg Maris Otter
0.25Kg Biscuit Malt
0.2Kg Chocolate Malt
30Gr First Gold Hop Pellets last 15 minutes of the boil

Hoping for a Porter like brew