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ispindel / MJ M84 musings

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UKSkydiver

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I've got a Czech Dark Lager on the go.

Pitched 1.5 packets of MJ M84 Boho Lager yeast on Friday (rehydrated @ 30c) and had a good frothy head on it within 24 hours. It's in a ferm fridge set at a constant 12c.

I'm roughly following the Brulosophy Fast Lager Method which is similar to the method in this Stop Worrying and Lager article, as well as the lager process in the James Morton 'Brew' book.

According to the ispindel output, after only four days it's already 71% attenuated at 1016, but when I take a hydrometer reading, it's more like 1023. I trust the hydrometer, so it's more like 60%.

I'm surprised that it's whizzing along as fast as it is given the lower temps, that said (according to other posts) it might slow down a bit now. Still plenty of time though....

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The method calls for 50% attenuation. I know this sounds like a daft question, but can I assume that 50% is the halfway point between OG and expected FG? No non-linear logarithmic equations to think about. Even so, it blasted through 1036 ages ago.

EDIT: * Actually, scrub that, I've found the formula and 50% is ~1028 - so on track to start ramping the temps up a bit.

I'm sat here working at my desk, having taken a sample, sipping. It's nicely chilled, it has a little bit of fizz, I assume from the dissolved CO2 because of the lower ferm temps. It tastes lovely. Fairly clean, no off flavours, with a hint of caramel. If it continues like this it will make a nice pint 🍻
 
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matt76

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I've got the same Czech Dark planned though pretty much sticking to the original recipe. Also planning to use M84 so will be interested to know how yours turns out.

Generally when I use lager yeast I've kept it cool (exact temp depends on the yeast strain) for a week then brought it up to 20degC to finish off. In addition I start taking gravity samples every 2 days after 1 week to check when it's hit FG, and then I cold crash for a few days.

The slight exception is the Helles I've just done where I used W-34/70 - I started at 15degC for 4 days, 17.5degC for 3 more days and then just brought it up to 20degC.

But I suppose if I had a Tilt or ispindel (which I'm quite interested in doing BTW) then I might be more inclined to change the temperature based more on current gravity than time.
 

krispn

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I'm looking for the same info as I put a lager in the fridge on the 21st using Wyeast Bavarian lager 2206. I checked the gravity a couple of days back as I wann do a similar fast lager thing and start to ramp up and the sample was tasting delicious, similar to what @UKSkydiver experienced: a bit of fizz, lovely malty flavour and I'd have ben happy to tap it at that but I've found some lagers I've made had a great flavour when sampling the trial jar but lost some of that big malt character by the time they were fermented and I'd love to know if it's simply a yeast choice thing or just 'The Way of the Lager'!
 

matt76

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I'm looking for the same info as I put a lager in the fridge on the 21st using Wyeast Bavarian lager 2206. I checked the gravity a couple of days back as I wann do a similar fast lager thing and start to ramp up and the sample was tasting delicious, similar to what @UKSkydiver experienced: a bit of fizz, lovely malty flavour and I'd have ben happy to tap it at that but I've found some lagers I've made had a great flavour when sampling the trial jar but lost some of that big malt character by the time they were fermented and I'd love to know if it's simply a yeast choice thing or just 'The Way of the Lager'!
I've used 2206 twice - first for a Vienna Lager I made a year ago, and immediately afterwards when I pitched a Munich Helles on to the yeast cake. Both were cracking beers, I really liked that yeast.

At that time I had no temperature control so I had to rely mainly on the natural cool temperature in my garage. But having said that, even now with a brew fridge I wouldn't do anything radically different, it's just that note I could dial in the precise temperature.

Anyway, looking back at my notes I did basically the same as I outlined above - 1 week in the cold to get the bulk of fermentation done, followed by a week at room temperature while it finishes off and cleans up after itself. After that it's simply cold crashing followed by packaging (in my case I bottle, no legs for me).

My rationale here is that any yeast, if it's going to produce off flavours it's going to do it in the early part of fermentation so that's where temperature control seems to really matter - so probably the first 3-4 days, maybe a week.

After this point it seems to matter less in my experience, hence I seem to get away with just bringing the FV into a warmer room temperature room - or as I would do nowadays, simply set the Inkbird on my brew fridge to 20degC.

Edit to add... Sometimes we deliberately want to encourage yeast to produce esters - Belgian styles maybe, German Hefeweizen for sure, and a bit of fruity ester is nice in Bitter. But for lagers these are deal-breakers so we want to keep the flavour profile very clean.
 
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krispn

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Yeah I think I’m just trying to emulate the beer styles I enjoy and having had great lager in Germany it’s never tasted better. I think this 2206 is a cracking yeast and I’d be happy to use it again going by results so far. My fingers are firmly crossed and like you say the flavour seems to have missed any dodgy fermentataion related off flavours and now it’s just riding the temp control to gently get the most out of this yeast and finish on a high note!
 
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