Late Malt Addition help

Discussion in 'General Beer Brewing Discussion' started by AndyBobandy, May 15, 2019.

Help Support The Homebrew Forum UK by donating:

  1. May 15, 2019 #1

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    This a question from a new brewer. Up until now I have only used recipe kits I've ordered online but I wanted to expand and brew my own recipe.

    I started with a clone of a black ale which turned out fine but doesn't have alot of body or 'mouthfeel'
    I read that adding a liquid malt extract will help increase the body of the beer but I can't find anything else that backs that up, or helps me figure out how it fits into my recipe other than reducing the amount of bittering hops.
    Does anyone have experience in doing all grain brew with added malt for body??
     
  2. May 15, 2019 #2

    Sadfield

    Sadfield

    Sadfield

    Landlord.

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2016
    Messages:
    2,050
    Likes Received:
    1,042
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    I think that info may have originated from kit brewing, perhaps. If one was to replace sugar in a kit for malt extract.

    In all grain brewing, as you have control over the mash process, this gives you ways to add body to the beer, through altering the recipe or mash conditions. The easiest is to mash at a higher temperature. This creates sugars (dextrins) that yeast can't consume, the wort becomes less fermentable and the remaining sugar add body to the beer.
    enzyme_activity_one_hour_mash.jpg

    Post up your recipe and mash temperature, and I'm sure you'll get plenty of feedback on improvements to make.
     
  3. May 15, 2019 #3

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thanks, that's already really helpful. Especially the graph! So just so the thought is out of my head, keeping my recipe the same but adding an amount of malt at the end of the boil will NOT produce similar results to raising the temperature to produce dextrins?
    I'll pop the recipe up as soon as I can.
     
  4. May 15, 2019 #4

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thanks, that's already really helpful. Especially the graph! So just so the thought is out of my head, keeping my recipe the same but adding an amount of malt at the end of the boil will NOT produce similar results to raising the temperature to produce dextrins?
    I'll pop the recipe up as soon as I can
     
  5. May 15, 2019 #5

    terrym

    terrym

    terrym

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2015
    Messages:
    4,440
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Location:
    North Sussex
    If you decide to go down the additional malt extract route I would add dried malt extract not add liquid malt. Fom experience I am increasingly of the opinion that some LME* is the cause of homebrew 'twang'. Dried malt appears to be fine.
    * And by that I mean any Muntons kits or LME, and/or what may be old or cheap or dark LME.
     
    Sadfield likes this.
  6. May 15, 2019 #6

    Sadfield

    Sadfield

    Sadfield

    Landlord.

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2016
    Messages:
    2,050
    Likes Received:
    1,042
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Adding extract will also significantly change the abv, flavour and bitterness of the final beer, and depending on how fermentable the extract is, may not add much extra body.
     
  7. May 15, 2019 #7

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    I'm not really sure of the best way to write my recipe on here but here goes.
    Grains:
    Breiss midnight wheat
    Caramunich 3
    Maris otter

    Hops:
    Columbus 60mins
    Chinook 20mins
    Centennial 20mins
    Centennial 5 mins

    Dry hops:
    Citra 7 days
    Centennial 7 days

    Yeast: safale US-05

    Strike temp 69 oc
    Mash 67oc

    Boil 60mins

    I think that's everything???
    Feel free to point out any glaring floors in the recipe, or unnecessary steps/ingredients.
    It really is my first time trying it for myself.
     
  8. May 15, 2019 #8

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ok cool, thanks. So, if I tried dry malt addition how would I need to adjust my recipe or figure out the quantity needed?
    I think thats what I'm mainly confused about, I'm happy to try these different techniques but without knowing how to apply the additions I would probably waste alot of time and ingredients
     
  9. May 15, 2019 #9

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Oh and Mash out 76oc
     
  10. May 15, 2019 #10

    Slid

    Slid

    Slid

    Forum Friend Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,210
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    Location:
    Bolton
    The layout of your recipe looks fine, but for most informative feedback, we really need to know the quantities of each ingredient?
     
  11. May 15, 2019 #11

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Okay, sorry. It's all new to me lol.

    15ltr water
    9ltr yeild

    Grains:
    196g Breiss midnight wheat
    226g Caramunich 3
    2.74kg Maris otter

    Hops:
    6.89g Columbus 60mins
    13.95g Chinook 20mins
    6.89g Centennial 5mins
    21.45g Centennial 5 mins

    Dry hops:
    Citra 13.95g 7 days
    Centennial 13.95g 7 days

    Yeast: safale US-05 6g
    55g brewers sugar

    Strike temp 69 oc
    Mash 67oc
    Mashout 76oc

    Boil 60mins
     
    GerritT likes this.
  12. May 15, 2019 #12

    Slid

    Slid

    Slid

    Forum Friend Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,210
    Likes Received:
    1,311
    Location:
    Bolton
    That looks like plenty of malt to get a pretty big beer and plenty of hops too!
    It may just be that you need more practice to start getting more of a feel for things like:
    • Doughing in the grains properly, to drive out as much air as possible from between the grains
    • Stirring the mash a bit half way through
    • Keeping the temperatures of the mash fairly stable (try putting the pot in the oven @ 50C
    • Doing some form of sparge (as slowly as you can) to increase the extraction of sugars
    All these (and more!) will help, but learning it all is a gradual process for most of us. acheers.
     
  13. May 15, 2019 #13

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Nice one, thanks alot.
    Maybe it's just lack of practice, I have a mash kettle so I can keep a nice consistent temperature throughout. Maybe I'll try fly sparging one day??
    I guess there's no quick fix to get the beer I'm hoping for, just practice and tweeks to the recipe!
     
  14. May 15, 2019 #14

    Sadfield

    Sadfield

    Sadfield

    Landlord.

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2016
    Messages:
    2,050
    Likes Received:
    1,042
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Looking at that recipe and your mash temperature of 67°c, I wouldn't expect a thin beer (although taste is subjective). You could increase the amount of caramunich by 25-50% and/or raise the mash temp by 1 or 2 degrees. One thing I would definitely suggest to a beginner (or anyone else) is to check the accuracy of your thermometer to be sure your mash was at 67°c. Here's a guide of how to.
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/beerandbrewing.com/amp/how-to-calibrate-a-thermometer
     
  15. May 15, 2019 #15

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thanks for the tip, I wasn't really sure where to start adjusting the recipe so I'll try increasing the Caramunich first. Also my thermometer isnt digital so perhaps that's a good investment for the future, especially if a 1 or 2 degree miss measure makes a noticeable difference.
     
  16. May 15, 2019 #16

    GerritT

    GerritT

    GerritT

    Landlord. Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,836
    Likes Received:
    583
    You're on the path to better beer! Have you already checked some of our threads about books, by any chance?
     
  17. May 15, 2019 #17

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    AndyBobandy

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2019
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    2
    Good advice. I'll have a look through and see what people are talking about, thanks.
     
    GerritT likes this.

Share This Page