Suggestions for a Belgian Strong Dark

[chthon]

Great information. Thanks for sharing this. Unfortunately I didn't taste the MM syrup as I just tipped it all in. I suspect from the packaging that they buy it in bulk from another source and then repackage it themselves.

What was your conclusion on the best syrup to use for darker Belgian beers? Is it your view that it's better for colour consistency to use a syrup with E150c if the colour in the recipe is derived from sugar alone?

It is the first time I will be using E150c, but if my hypothesis about the D90 and D180 syrups is correct, it should give good coloring. I used it in a Kasteeel Donker kloon, which was pitch black.

 

[chthon]

@chthon Just to continue the debate on this, have you read the Brulosophy article on creating candi syrup using sodium hydroxide (lye)?

https://brulosophy.com/2016/03/14/belgian-candi-syrup-homemade-vs-commercial-exbeeriment-results/
I wonder if candi syrup made in this way is colour stable? The beers in the pictures in that article are much more what I was expecting in terms of colour, even if the home made syrup did come in a bit light.

On the Flemish homebrew forum we have a chemist who works in the food industry, and he actually discourages making them this way. It is not completely safe or healthy. Industrial producers have better and more refined processes.

I would actually recommend more to experiment with self-made invert syrup, black treacle or blackstrap molasses, and store bought caramel. Mix them in different recipes and see what works.

 

[chthon]

But one uses very little of it, and bitterness is not the worst attribute in a beer ingredient....

Worth noting one of the comments to the Pursuit of Abbeyness article I linked above :

Dark syrups and sugars do not add the amount of color most think they do. If you crunch the numbers and use Post-Boil Volume as the input to the Morey equation rather than the generally accepted value of Fermenter volume (this will distort the color prediction high), you’ll see that save for the darkest of syrups being produced, you’d actually need whopping amounts to match some of the colors in BLAM and that are quoted in other sources for these beers.

I would say that many are still using dark syrups or sugars for the lion’s share of color and to be clear, I can’t say with certainty that other breweries besides Rochefort are using a flavor neutral colorant. [such as Pure Malt RB1500/40 or Sinamar]

About the taste: that was more as a way of identifying it, rather than as a qualitative statement.

 

[Mrhandsome]

I'm making a 10l Belgian quad this weekend:
2kg extra pale
1.5kg Pilsner
500g homemade candi syrup

8g zeus @60
15g hallertauer mittelfrueh @30 an 10

WLP530 yeast

I'm doing a double mash like I did with my recent impy stout (I got 85% efficientcy) and boiling down the first runnings to a syrup for colour.

The only thing I'm not sure about is the syrup. What percentage should I be aiming for?

 

[buddsy]

Hi friends

I fancy having a go at David Heaths recent Dubbel.




Looking at the recipe in brewfather despite the beer being a nice strength it seems to have quite a light weight grain bill? Even the addition of the candi doesnt seem so large?

I see the recipe uses 2 packs of yeast and while the OG reflects the reasonably small grain bill the FG seems very low. I take it this is due to the double yeast?

Most of my brews have finished around the 1.012 mark so am slightly worried I will make this and end up with a low alcohol Belgium beer and we wouldnt want that now would we!

Am I being overly cautions? Should I just go for it as per recipe?

buddsy

 

[Richard_H]

Hi friends

I fancy having a go at David Heaths recent Dubbel.




Looking at the recipe in brewfather despite the beer being a nice strength it seems to have quite a light weight grain bill? Even the addition of the candi doesnt seem so large?

I see the recipe uses 2 packs of yeast and while the OG reflects the reasonably small grain bill the FG seems very low. I take it this is due to the double yeast?

Most of my brews have finished around the 1.012 mark so am slightly worried I will make this and end up with a low alcohol Belgium beer and we wouldnt want that now would we!

Am I being overly cautions? Should I just go for it as per recipe?

buddsy

Having skipped through that video David is aiming for 91% attenuation and while I don't want to say he is wrong as he is very experienced but that is a tad optimistic for most of us, and in my experience 2 packs of yeast reduces the chance of stalling rather than performing a higher attenuation than expected.

The good thing is that recipe is listed in % so personally I would follow it but build a recipe with an SG around 1.068, so if you end up at 1.012 then you will have 7.3%. If it finishes lower then bonus but you are already into 82% attenuation. That should give you a margin for error