Timothy Taylor landlord

[hughjamton]

Thinking of doing the Graham Wheeler Landlord tomorrow.
It calls for white sugar, anyone done it? Anyone replaced the sugar with grains?
Is there any benefit, or should I just add the sugar?

 

[Cheshire Cat]

My recipe has no sugar its
4200g Maris otter
100g crystal 55 Lovibond
30g black malt

 

[Galena]

I have never made Landlord, though it is on my list. I have the GW book and personally although there can be a good reason for adding sugar, ti thin the body for example I think he overuses it and I have moved away from his recipes though still refer to them.
The Brewfather app, has 4 recipes for Landlord as far as I could see, and none of them add sugar and are All Grain

 

[Scrattajack]

Timothy Taylor's does use sugar in the brewing process, I understand but it would be brewing sugar. Maybe use syrup instead of pure cane to avoid sugar tang?

 

[obscure]

Just had a look at the recipe as couldn’t recall it using sugar, and was right so assume GW dropped the sugar in newer editions (I have the third edition) it’s just pale malt and black malt. Ive done this a few times and while I don’t think it an exact match for the beer it’s still a really nice very drinkable bitter.

 

[An Ankoù]

Thinking of doing the Graham Wheeler Landlord tomorrow.
It calls for white sugar, anyone done it? Anyone replaced the sugar with grains?
Is there any benefit, or should I just add the sugar?

I've made Landlord. Don't know if it was a good copy because I can't remember what it tastes like, but it was an ok beer. Landlord calls for Golden Promise malt and West Yorkshire yeast, which is a top-cropping yeast so you'll need plenty of headspace. I think both G.P. and the right yeast are essential if you want to get anywhere close.

While I can't remember the exact flavour, I do know that I've drunk a lot of it in various places at various times and it's a very OK beer, but I don't understand why it gets all the praise and acclaim that it does. It's just a good bitter of which there are many. IMO.

 

[obscure]

I've made Landlord. Don't know if it was a good copy because I can't remember what it tastes like, but it was an ok beer. Landlord calls for Golden Promise and West Yorkshire yeast, which is a top-cropping yeast so you'll need plenty of headspace. I think both G.P. and the right yeast are essential if you want to get anywhere close.

I suppose it depends if you want a clone or just a good bitter. I’ve made this was Maris Otter, and S-04 and it produces a decent bitter but as mentioned not really an exact match for Landlord.

I’m now rather tempted to give this a go with Golden Promise and West Yorkshire yeast to see if it comes closer as when properly kept Landlord is a fantastic cask ale.

 

[An Ankoù]

Not quite on topic, but as we're talking about Wheeler and different malts, many of his recipes call for Pipkin and/or Halcyon pale malt. I haven't seen these for ages. Does anyone know if they're still available.
Also on Wheeler: His book"Brew Your Own British Real Ale at Home" CAMRA, 1998, 2001 with Roger Protz is a great book even though he neglects yeast and water chemistry. The book "Brew Your Own British Real Ale" 3rd Edition 2014, reprinted 2018 is a disgrace.The recipes are dumbed down with no reference to the type of malt ans with black malt used indiscriminately for colouring. Shame on CAMRA for this work.

 

[Scottyburto]

What hops do you use?

 

[trueblue]

According to their virtual tour no sign of sugar but most traditional breweries will use invert sugar. This is one of my regular beers and the version from the third book is the best. To get it close you MUST use the West Yorkshire yeast. Link to the virtual tour below good watch.

 

[An Ankoù]

I suppose it depends if you want a clone or just a good bitter. I’ve made this was Maris Otter, and S-04 and it produces a decent bitter but as mentioned not really an exact match for Landlord.

I’m now rather tempted to give this a go with Golden Promise and West Yorkshire yeast to see if it comes closer as when properly kept Landlord is a fantastic cask ale.

I'm not sure I've ever made a clone which is indistinguishable from the real thing, there are just too many variables, but sourcing the closest ingredients, water profile, yeast and even fermentation method is bound to bring us a bit closer, I think. And yes, I've missed by a mile in many cases, but it's been a cracking beer nonetheless.

 

[An Ankoù]

What hops do you use?

Who?
Styrians and Fuggles in the boil, Goldings to finish.
The later edition of the "Wheeler" has Styrians and Goldings in the boil and Styrians to finish.

 

[Scottyburto]

Who?
Styrians and Fuggles in the boil, Goldings to finish.
The later edition of the "Wheeler" has Styrians and Goldings in the boil and Styrians to finish.

Sorry I was just asking generally what hops are in landlord.

 

[obscure]

Sorry I was just asking generally what hops are in landlord.

Going by the Timothy Taylor website ”Styrian Goldings, Goldings, Fuggles”

 

[trueblue]

Not quite on topic, but as we're talking about Wheeler and different malts, many of his recipes call for Pipkin and/or Halcyon pale malt. I haven't seen these for ages. Does anyone know if they're still available.
Also on Wheeler: His book"Brew Your Own British Real Ale at Home" CAMRA, 1998, 2001 with Roger Protz is a great book even though he neglects yeast and water chemistry. The book "Brew Your Own British Real Ale" 3rd Edition 2014, reprinted 2018 is a disgrace.The recipes are dumbed down with no reference to the type of malt ans with black malt used indiscriminately for colouring. Shame on CAMRA for this work.

When GW was active on Jim's forum he stated he purposely omitted the yeast because when he worked out the recipes in most cases he would use yeast from that brewery and knowing that was rarely going to be an option for most home brewers he left it open to what was available. Remember most recipes were written before liquid yeast were available.

 

[Hanglow]

Just use generic pale malts for anything that calls for halcyon or pipkin. They have typically been superceded by malts with higher yields, like laureate, planet, craft or concerto etc

 

[hughjamton]

Right!
Do you know, when your knocking on a bit, and you know why you're going into a room and what you want to get, but as you walk through the door, you forget why you're there. Or you ask what's for dinner, 3 times, convinced you've not already asked.
Well there's another version, your trying to think what beer to make, so you look through your books for inspiration.
So, in your head you make a short list, then you narrow it down to two.
Then you notice one has got sugar in it, and you wonder if you can substitute the sugar for more grains, your not sure so you ask the forum.
You quite happily type out the question on your phone, post it, then within a couple of minutes people are responding to your query, brilliant.
But, then you notice they're all talking about TT Landlord, what a coincidence, that was the other beer on your short list!
However, you then notice all the keys on your phone must of temporarily mixed themselves up! Cos what you really typed was Everards Tiger.
That's what must've happened, I can't think of another explanation.
Anyway, has anyone ever made Everards Tiger and substituted the sugar?

 

[An Ankoù]

When GW was active on Jim's forum he stated he purposely omitted the yeast because when he worked out the recipes in most cases he would use yeast from that brewery and knowing that was rarely going to be an option for most home brewers he left it open to what was available. Remember most recipes were written before liquid yeast were available.

That makes sense.

 

[trummy]

One of my favourites - a couple of pints mid bike ride, wonderful - best of luck one and all!

 

[An Ankoù]

Right!
Do you know, when your knocking on a bit, and you know why you're going into a room and what you want to get, but as you walk through the door, you forget why you're there. Or you ask what's for dinner, 3 times, convinced you've not already asked.
Well there's another version, your trying to think what beer to make, so you look through your books for inspiration.
So, in your head you make a short list, then you narrow it down to two.
Then you notice one has got sugar in it, and you wonder if you can substitute the sugar for more grains, your not sure so you ask the forum.
You quite happily type out the question on your phone, post it, then within a couple of minutes people are responding to your query, brilliant.
But, then you notice they're all talking about TT Landlord, what a coincidence, that was the other beer on your short list!
However, you then notice all the keys on your phone must of temporarily mixed themselves up! Cos what you really typed was Everards Tiger.
That's what must've happened, I can't think of another explanation.
Anyway, has anyone ever made Everards Tiger and substituted the sugar?

Tiger isn't in the old edition, but three other Everards recipes are and they all specify Maris Otter. The Beacon Bitter also has a bit of sugar. 205g of white sugar isn't very much, I'd go with it.