"Toasted" Beer Recipe?

Discussion in 'General Recipe Discussion' started by matt76, May 16, 2019.

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  1. May 16, 2019 #1

    matt76

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    When I was Barcelona last week I tried a few of these San Miguel "Selecta" - The can says it's toasted, and I've had a few similar "toasted" beers in Spain before.

    Bit darker than your average lager, more amber, it tastes quite malty but not hoppy, 6.2% ABV - maybe it's like an Oktoberfest beer (but don't know as I've never been to Oktoberfest!).

    From the can it boasts 3 malts and 3 hops. It lists the ingredients as malted barley, maize and hops - is there such a thing as toasted malt? Not sure if maize counts as a malt either.

    Anyone got any ideas what the recipe might look like? I might have a go at a malty lager like this sometime.

    Malt:
    Base malt - 60-80% lager or Pilsner malt?
    Some Vienna malt maybe?
    What else could go in there?

    Hops - I'd guess something typical like saaz?

    Any other thoughts?

    Cheers,

    Matt

    20190508_190011.jpg
     
  2. May 17, 2019 #2

    Zephyr259

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    Toasted flavours should come from the "high kilned" malts like the various styles of amber malt including victory and biscuit. I'd brew something like this as a base of pilsner with a hefty dose of munich then maybe a touch of something darker like amber malt. Might also get close with something like a vienna lager which is mostly vienna malt with varying proportions of pilsner and munich to balance it out.

    I don't think you can malt maize, or maybe it's just that no one does. That will lighten the flavour and maybe make it more crisp which could be to balance out the increased maltiness you'd get from munich malt.

    I'd go for something noble on the hop front, Saaz is always good in a lager.
     
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  3. May 17, 2019 #3

    Sadfield

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    +1 on Munich Malt. This beer sounds like a Märzen style lager.
     
  4. May 17, 2019 #4

    MyQul

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    As others have said munich is what you want to add
     
  5. May 17, 2019 #5

    matt76

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    So is there no such thing as "toasted malt"? Rather, (as you've mentioned already) does it mean we use "high kilned" malts that give a toasted flavour?

    I Googled "toasted malts" and found instructions how to toast your own malts (now there's a thought for experimentation!) but nothing leapt out from the likes of The Homebrew Shop, Malt Miller, Geterbrewed etc where they were actually selling toasted malts.
     
  6. May 17, 2019 #6

    Zephyr259

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    I think it's just a case of "toasting" being a vague term, maltsters often use the term high-kilned as they're kiled at higher temperatures than pale malts but not high enough to become roasted. Here's the page for Simpson's malts which shows how they break down the classifications.

    Yeah, when the malt is kilned somewhere between the temperatures used for pale and roasted malt you get more Mailard reactions which will give flavours including toast, bread crust and biscuits. This is also what you'll be getting by "toasting" pale malt at home.
     
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  7. May 17, 2019 #7

    ACBEV

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    I'd go along with Munich and Amber malts, perhaps some brown malt or low colour Chocolate malt.

    When I read the title "Toasted beer recipe", it reminded me of using toasted wholemeal bread i.e. 5 slices toasted and crushed in a blender, then added to the mash.
     
  8. May 17, 2019 #8

    jceg316

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    There's this recipe I used to make which called for toasted malt, but the same book it was from said it can be made by putting pale malt in the oven. From what I remember there were no 'toasty' flavoured, more a really pronounced nutty flavour, it was great. This site is has some good instructions: http://howtobrew.com/book/section-4/experiment/toasting-your-own-malt. I didn't bother putting the malt in a bag for a week before use, I oven cooked the malt and put it straight in the mash tun. Beer was fantastic.
     
  9. May 17, 2019 #9

    Drunkula

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    There are a few videos out there on it. I did it and made a brown ale but it was back when I kept getting polyphenol problems and the beer tasted like crap.

    I had really good successes making crystal malt. I stewed them with a sous vide method in a chicken roasting bag (most other bags let water in) then dried them in the oven and roasted them to various colours. The biggest trick is the amount of water to use. Using more gets you an amazingly glassy caramel result but takes ages to dry. Haven't got my notes to check the ratio that was the best compromise.
     
  10. May 17, 2019 #10

    matt76

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    Thanks all for your replies and suggestions so far, all interesting stuff.

    So maybe something like this:
    60% lager malt
    20% Munich malt
    20% Amber malt

    Hops: something like saaz or halletauer?

    ?
     
  11. May 17, 2019 #11

    Sadfield

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    Personally, I think this beer is more likely to be Pilsner, Vienna and Munich malt. Amber malt is more a British thing and probably a bit full on, if using it I'd use much less (5%).

    I fully recommended the Randy Mosher's book Mastering Homebrew as it has a good section outlining the different types of malt, what they add to a beer, and in what styles they are generally used.
     
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  12. May 17, 2019 #12

    IainM

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    I used to live in Barcelona in my pre-brewing days, and before the city got taken over by craft beer bars selling decent stuff, so I used to knock these back like no business as the only alternative to the blandest of lager. Voll Damm and Moritz Epidor were the best imo, but they were all decent. The story goes that the trend was started by by Damm brewery in th 1950s because the head brewer was partial to Oktoberfest / Marzen / Dunkle beers and wanted to replicate the style back home. I brewed a Munich Dunkle a couple of years ago, with Munich as the base malt, and it's certainly the closest thing to a San Miguel Selecta I've ever tried.
     
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  13. May 17, 2019 #13

    MrRook

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    Here in the States suppliers of gluten free ingredients have malted corn.
     
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  14. May 17, 2019 #14

    the baron

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    IainM could you possibly post your recipe as it does sound very interesting
    Thanks Pete
     
  15. May 17, 2019 #15

    Zephyr259

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    Sadfield's got a point here, probably don't need the amber and even if you fancy it, could be tasty, 20% is way too much, 5% probably about right.
     
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  16. May 17, 2019 #16

    matt76

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    Seconded athumb..
     
  17. May 18, 2019 #17

    IainM

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    It was very simple.

    25L, using Ashbeck water, 1.055-1.013.
    6kg Munich malt
    250g BlackPrinz
    60 min Mash @ 67C
    75 min boil
    40g Hallertau (5%) 60 mins
    10g Hallertau 20 mins
    0.5 protofloc 5 mins
    Mangrove Jacks M76 Bavarian Lager, 3 packs, ferment cold

    This came out on the dark side, but the taste was there. I recon you could get away with doing it as a Munich / Hallertau smash.
     
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  18. May 18, 2019 #18

    matt76

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    I found this recipe:
    30% Munich
    40% Vienna
    20% Pilsner
    10% Caramunich 1

    Then I thought ~20 IBUs worth of typical lager hops (don't know which one yet) for 60 mins plus another 5 IBUs worth for the final 5-10 mins.

    Ferment with WY2124 or 2112 (I have no temp control and these are supposed to be ok at 20degC)
     
  19. May 18, 2019 #19

    the baron

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    Thanks Iain is the blackprinz just for colour
    Thanks Pete
     
  20. May 19, 2019 #20

    IainM

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    Yup, just for colour, though it was a bit too much for the style.
     
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