What could possibly go wrong?!

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gillonstewart

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There used to be a homebrew shop fairly local to me in Forfar. It was still 25 miles away but had everything you could need and you always got good conversation with the owner and always spent a fortune.

This was my only source of CO2 and when the shop closed down I basically stopped home-brewing as a result. I had a Newcastle brown ale copycat kit which I never brewed due to the lack of gas and I found it at the back of the cupboard.

It's a decade out of date but I'm thinking it's probably just the yeast that's not usable. The malt in the can is probably fine. I'm going to clean out the spare pressure barrel and brew it up straight in the barrel. Using fresh yeast and nutrient.

What could possibly go wrong? 🤣
 

DocAnna

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If there are no dents in the can then it could work out just fine. Your risks all relate to slow growing bacteria that might have not been killed by adequate canning practices at the time. There is a rare risk of butulism with old canned foods - If the tin opens with a pressure release like opening a can of juice, or a spurt then I suggest you may not want to go any further than it. Similarly if it’s dented significantly or smells off.
 
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What's mentioned above and staleness. Canning has a long shelf life but still of limited value. Might be good as an experiment. Kit's are not expensive enough for the effort. Just my opinion.
 

gillonstewart

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Kit's are not expensive enough for the effort.
Pretty pricey to a man of limited means such as myself (not helped by an 800% rise in my car insurance after I scuffed the bumper on my boss's 3 hour old range rover, consequential rises in my other car insurance, 300% rise in electricity, the cost of heating oil going from 40ppl to £1.40ppl etc. etc. All coupled to a £5k pay cut)

Cost saving isn't really the point though, I hate to waste anything. I've got a big can of malt that'll cost nothing but time to brew (already got all the other ingredients anyway) so other than a possibility of some fairly notable upside down brown fountains and a faint possibility of an unpleasant death by botulism (I'd much rather something a bit quicker) I'm going to give it a blast... We'll find out in a couple of months whether that ends up being a literal blast haha
 

Dutto

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Just made a Coopers IPA with 500g of DME and a Coopers English Bitter with a Coopers Amber LME - all of which was at least one and sometimes two years OOD.

Both brews were a lot darker than expected (especially the IPA) and although not opened, the DME had gone dark on one side.

Both brews tasted “metallic” when first tried, but subsequently came good despite being consumed much too early.

I still have 500g of DME and a can of LME that are OOD by a couple of years, but I’m waiting for an in date Ruby Red Ale to carbonate & condition and have a new stock of kits (a Lager and an IPA) and some new DME so …. ? At the moment, the thinking is to dump the OOD stuff rather than see what will happen.

BTW, the new kits came in (with 500g of DME for each kit) at about £25 for 40 pints. In a local pub that would garner 5 or 6 stone-cold insipid pints so it’s still a no-brainer!

Enjoy!
:hat:
 
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Cost saving isn't really the point though, I hate to waste anything.
I do appreciate the other side of the coin and the personal philosophy one might have about wasting. And nothing's simply yes or no. Price is a relative aspect. It is only an opinion of whether it's better to brew an old kit, overall, versus a fresh one.
I approach a batch with the intention of making the best one possible. Rightly or wrongly, I feel I've lined myself up behind the eight ball if I start with ingredients that are really old.
As a side note, here in Detroit, we get raked over the coals on insurance. $3.3K per year we pay for one car we own (an '09 no less) and we don't have a replacement option in place if it were to be totaled. It's a Detroit prejudiced thing. If I were to live two hundred yards north (just across Eight Mile (like the movie), I'd pay about $600/year but probably even less.
 

Brew_DD2

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There used to be a homebrew shop fairly local to me in Forfar. It was still 25 miles away but had everything you could need and you always got good conversation with the owner and always spent a fortune.

This was my only source of CO2 and when the shop closed down I basically stopped home-brewing as a result. I had a Newcastle brown ale copycat kit which I never brewed due to the lack of gas and I found it at the back of the cupboard.

It's a decade out of date but I'm thinking it's probably just the yeast that's not usable. The malt in the can is probably fine. I'm going to clean out the spare pressure barrel and brew it up straight in the barrel. Using fresh yeast and nutrient.

What could possibly go wrong? 🤣

You're not far away from me. I'm based in Blairgowrie. Lots of brewers on here from Tayside/Angus area.
 
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Waste not - want not. However, if your malt can is 10 years out of date, it is already waste. When you open it, it will be quite dark and smell sour. I almost guarantee it. I've found cans of LME which looked like rugby balls they were so bulged. I've seen old cans which actually blew the seams from the can and slowly bled in the storage box.

Don't waste your time and the other ingredients on old extract . . . it just isn't worth it.
 

gillonstewart

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You're not far away from me. I'm based in Blairgowrie. Lots of brewers on here from Tayside/Angus area.
Oh, that's good to know. I'm actually up by drimmie. Where does one go about getting CO2 nowadays since Forfar closed? There was a shop opened very briefly in Dundee after Forfar closed but it only lasted a couple of months.

I've got an empty S30 bottle and was convinced I had a pub bottle in the shed butctryas I might I can't find it. I'm starting to think it's fell foul of one of the OH's "tidying" efforts (is throwing out all my stuff).

I've been looking into making/using a soda stream adaptor or buying the 8g capsules and suitable caps. I don't want to spend too much as eventually I'd like a proper set up.

I chopped the end off of a 12g capsule and directed the gas into the lid of the cider barrel. It won't pressurise it obviously but will hopefully stop it going off before I can sort out gas.
 

Dutto

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Nowt the matter with Sodastream! Got 3x10 litre kegs hooked up at the minute.

I only pressurise to 5psi to 10psi so it’s not even expensive - but it IS convenient!

Enjoy!
:hat:
 

Brew_DD2

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Oh, that's good to know. I'm actually up by drimmie. Where does one go about getting CO2 nowadays since Forfar closed? There was a shop opened very briefly in Dundee after Forfar closed but it only lasted a couple of months.

I've got an empty S30 bottle and was convinced I had a pub bottle in the shed butctryas I might I can't find it. I'm starting to think it's fell foul of one of the OH's "tidying" efforts (is throwing out all my stuff).

I've been looking into making/using a soda stream adaptor or buying the 8g capsules and suitable caps. I don't want to spend too much as eventually I'd like a proper set up.

I chopped the end off of a 12g capsule and directed the gas into the lid of the cider barrel. It won't pressurise it obviously but will hopefully stop it going off before I can sort out gas.

I think you're going to struggle to get someone to fill up bottles that aren't theirs. I go down to Stirling usually once or twice a year to swap my empty 6.35kg bottle for another one. It's a long way to go for it, but thankfully it's not a journey I have to make often. I use Russell Gas. I think they've switched suppliers, and subsequently prices went up substantially for new customers, but worth giving them a ring.

There is a company called Tay Gas that supplies the pubs, but I don't think they sell for personal usage. If you find out, please let me know.
 
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gillonstewart

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There is a company called Tay Gas that supplies the pubs
I buy my propane and butane from taygas. I actually buy in the region of 100 W size bottles of CO2 for work from BOC every month and currently working on a distribution system for liquid CO2 as well but I'd be instantly sacked if I were caught refilling my S30 bottle!

There is a company, Ellesmere home brew that will refill your bottles if you post them down but it seems a bit of a faff.

Think I'll just go with capsules just now for a short term solution and look at getting a more permanent solution. I was looking at refill adaptors for soda stream bottles which could be a good idea.
 

AccoBrew

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I do appreciate the other side of the coin and the personal philosophy one might have about wasting. And nothing's simply yes or no. Price is a relative aspect. It is only an opinion of whether it's better to brew an old kit, overall, versus a fresh one.
I approach a batch with the intention of making the best one possible. Rightly or wrongly, I feel I've lined myself up behind the eight ball if I start with ingredients that are really old.
As a side note, here in Detroit, we get raked over the coals on insurance. $3.3K per year we pay for one car we own (an '09 no less) and we don't have a replacement option in place if it were to be totaled. It's a Detroit prejudiced thing. If I were to live two hundred yards north (just across Eight Mile (like the movie), I'd pay about $600/year but probably even less.
Blimmy, why such a big difference in cost over 200 yds..?? insurance here in uk is a lot cheaper.
When we lived in Oz you paid what they call Reggo which includes 3rd party cover. We then paid to have fully comp cover but get no reduction in the Reggo cost which was a rip off by the government.
 
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difference in cost over 200 yds
I live in Detroit, proper, and across the street which you can see through my back yard, is a suburb. Regardless of our perfect records (no tickets or accidents), we pay exorbitant amounts only because of where we live.
Michigan has "No Fault" which means, among other things, that the insurance companies get sued which, in turn, passes the cost to the consumer. Detroit has an extremely high rate of suing which is promoted by lawyers. We have a high percentage at near-poverty level so maybe the "get rich quick" idea is more enticing. There are other variables. Michigan has one of the highest insurance rates if not the highest in the US.
So we pay 3X, 4X, 5X what is paid in the suburbs.
 

AccoBrew

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I live in Detroit, proper, and across the street which you can see through my back yard, is a suburb. Regardless of our perfect records (no tickets or accidents), we pay exorbitant amounts only because of where we live.
Michigan has "No Fault" which means, among other things, that the insurance companies get sued which, in turn, passes the cost to the consumer. Detroit has an extremely high rate of suing which is promoted by lawyers. We have a high percentage at near-poverty level so maybe the "get rich quick" idea is more enticing. There are other variables. Michigan has one of the highest insurance rates if not the highest in the US.
So we pay 3X, 4X, 5X what is paid in the suburbs.
Happens over here too. People throwing themselves on the bonnets of cars and claiming you hit them. Thank goodness for dash cams.
 
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People throwing themselves on the bonnets of cars and claiming you hit them.
Years ago, my wife had someone try and back up with their car with the intention of hitting ours. It was late at night so no witnesses. Anyway, she put the car in reverse and then sped around the vehicle. I was impressed by her reaction because who's expecting that to happen out of the blue?
Edit: I asked my wife to retell me that story this morning. We concluded that it was more likely just a drunk driver who didn't see our car and was backing up because he missed his turn. Nonetheless, she still had to think quickly and hit reverse to avoid being collided with.
Side note: There would have been no reason for the driver to hit our car intentionally as, according to a retired cop, without witnesses it would be one driver's word against another.
 
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Cwrw666

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However, if your malt can is 10 years out of date, it is already waste. When you open it, it will be quite dark and smell sour.
I recently made a Tiny Rebel 'Cwtch' kit that was 4 years out of date. The yeast was totally dead so used a fresh packet. It's actually quite horrible and yes there's a slight sourness to it.
 

moto748

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I would just say that CO2 is hardly an essential for home brewing. I manage perfectly happily without it, as do many more, I'm sure.
 
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