What do people use to help clear their beer?

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Cwrw666

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Protafloc & time, I never worry about any chill haze
Ditto.
Also I filter my beer through my moustache so a bit of haze isn't really a problem.
BTW never use gelatine - you get bits of it floating around and it's too much like finding a stray bogey in your beer...
 

peebee

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I cold crash for a couple of days at -1 or -2 C it definitely clears the beer. Here is Charlie Bamforth explaining why.
That was a very interesting video. But I don't think Dr Bamford mentions "cold crash" once, despite Brad's prompts. He's talking about "cold conditioning", an established method to stabilise beer against the cold ("chill haze" - a protein thing). He even glorifies the use of Isinglass (a "real" fining agent). As for "explaining why" (cold crash that is) that video is a bit of an own goal; it does nothing of the sort! He does advocate chilling to -1, -2 even, for a couple of days which was a surprise as I've been taken in by papers suggesting 6-7C is cold enough for lagering - but Dr Bamford goes on to point out the beer then needs filtering while maintaining the -1 or -2C else the haze just goes back into solution.

Nothing on "cold crash" as a method of clearing larger particulate, which isn't surprising because Dr Bamford is very much orientated about a molecular level, not a mechanical (physical) level. Whereas:

Cold crashing changes the viscosity of the liquid, ...
Not the "viscosity" argument? The difference between beer, with pretty nearly the viscosity of water, and "cold beer", with pretty nearly the viscosity of water?

I thought I was stretching it using the term "subtle", but at least I didn't dip that far into the land of Narnia.



I can't stop people thinking "cold crash" works for them, but hopefully I can stop some of the advice for beginners suggesting it has such an important role in home-brewing.
 

NPi

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That was a very interesting video. But I don't think Dr Bamford mentions "cold crash" once, despite Brad's prompts. He's talking about "cold conditioning", an established method to stabilise beer against the cold ("chill haze" - a protein thing). He even glorifies the use of Isinglass (a "real" fining agent). As for "explaining why" (cold crash that is) that video is a bit of an own goal; it does nothing of the sort! He does advocate chilling to -1, -2 even, for a couple of days which was a surprise as I've been taken in by papers suggesting 6-7C is cold enough for lagering - but Dr Bamford goes on to point out the beer then needs filtering while maintaining the -1 or -2C else the haze just goes back into solution.

Nothing on "cold crash" as a method of clearing larger particulate, which isn't surprising because Dr Bamford is very much orientated about a molecular level, not a mechanical (physical) level. Whereas:


Not the "viscosity" argument? The difference between beer, with pretty nearly the viscosity of water, and "cold beer", with pretty nearly the viscosity of water?

I thought I was stretching it using the term "subtle", but at least I didn't dip that far into the land of Narnia.



I can't stop people thinking "cold crash" works for them, but hopefully I can stop some of the advice for beginners suggesting it has such an important role in home-brewing.
Temperature has a marked effect on the viscosity of liquids.

Off topic, but you can actually hear the difference in cold vs hot water when poured. Because hot water is more viscous. Cold crashing performs the same role as cold conditioning but to a lesser extent.
 
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foxbat

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Viscosity of water at 20C: 1.00 mPa·s
Viscosity of water at 4C: 1.57 mPa·s

That's the sound of me climbing back into my box that you can hear. ;)
 

peebee

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… Because hot water is more viscous. …
In Narnia perhaps? Temperature dependence of viscosity - Wikipedia. Though I was surprised gases do increase in viscosity with increased temperature. And I don't actually know if beer is one of the hinted at exceptions ("In liquids it usually decreases …"). But be serious, is the changes in viscosity due to a few degrees "C" going to make radical difference to particulates sinking in beer? I think it will be the stilling of movement caused by; any yeast activity declining, thermal currents stilling - at 4C thermal currents start reversing, or the like.

And I don't say cold doesn't assist particulates to sink, just argue that cold is a minor player in the process (time being a big player) and "cold crash" gets far too much emphasis.
 

foxy

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That was a very interesting video. But I don't think Dr Bamford mentions "cold crash" once, despite Brad's prompts. He's talking about "cold conditioning", an established method to stabilise beer against the cold ("chill haze" - a protein thing). He even glorifies the use of Isinglass (a "real" fining agent). As for "explaining why" (cold crash that is) that video is a bit of an own goal; it does nothing of the sort! He does advocate chilling to -1, -2 even, for a couple of days which was a surprise as I've been taken in by papers suggesting 6-7C is cold enough for lagering - but Dr Bamford goes on to point out the beer then needs filtering while maintaining the -1 or -2C else the haze just goes back into solution.

Nothing on "cold crash" as a method of clearing larger particulate, which isn't surprising because Dr Bamford is very much orientated about a molecular level, not a mechanical (physical) level. Whereas:


Not the "viscosity" argument? The difference between beer, with pretty nearly the viscosity of water, and "cold beer", with pretty nearly the viscosity of water?

I thought I was stretching it using the term "subtle", but at least I didn't dip that far into the land of Narnia.



I can't stop people thinking "cold crash" works for them, but hopefully I can stop some of the advice for beginners suggesting it has such an important role in home-brewing.
What Charlie Bamforth calls 'cold conditioning' is 'cold crashing' he states that -1 to-2 C for 2 days is better than + 1 C for a couple of months I am sure he was exaggerating.
Here is another podcast which he takes the listener through the whole process for reducing beer haze (bar crushing of the malt) around the 51 minute mark he talks about 'cold conditioning' Anyone who has problems with beer haze well worth listening to the whole podcast. It also goes without saying leaving the trub in the kettle and getting clear wort into the fermenter is also a factor for getting a clear beer into the glass.
 
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yrhendystu

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Cold crashing and time.
But then I'm only doing kits ( but happy with quality of what I can produce with a minimum of effort ).
Same. I leave it in the bucket for about 2-3 weeks now. For the last week I move it off my insulation and heat pad and onto the concrete floor to cool right down (I brew in the shed). The beer bottled is crystal clear. Bottles I have from when I first started earlier this year have a yeast cloud.
 

peebee

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What Charlie Bamforth calls 'cold conditioning' is 'cold crashing' …
No it's not!

"Cold conditioning" is a long established technique of stabilising beer against haze, and has the side-effect of altering flavour and mouthfeel in a way some find beneficial ("lagering"). The crass "cold crashing" is a new "technique" attributed with all sorts of benefits, chiefly those that would normally be the function of "real" finings (i.e. general clarification). The two are often used interchangeably, mainly by those who think "cold crashing" sounds sort of "cool".

Dr Bamford talks about "cold conditioning". Purveyors of snake-oil talk of "cold crashing".



Leaving the trub in the kettle (often with the help of Irish Moss and the like) is a completely different subject that I have not been arguing against (in fact I've always used Irish Moss). Don't try to discredit my argument by pushing the idea into peoples heads that I'm against other clarification techniques (that work!).

Anyway, I promised myself a few years ago not to go off on one when first caught up in the wave of new "craft beer" brewing ideas. Especially when I started to benefit from some of them. But "cold crash" (and "styles" ... pah!) has sort of stuck in my throat. I'll stop ranting (for now!).
 

rekabmit

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Yep. It still works out fine eventually, but looks like a lava lamp fermenter for a few days!
So I added a tablet yo my brew after adding it to quarter cup of water. Then allowed last 15 of the boil. I did not see much happen. Cooled transfered at 35 and within an hour in cellar loads of fluffy clouds in the fermenter. Do I leave this or do I need to rack to another bucket? First home user normally just use isinglass at the end pre barrelling.
 

rekabmit

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Thanks will leave it and peer under the lid in another 7 days. My last brew was really cloudy so wanted to try a nice clean one this time.
 

the baron

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So I added a tablet yo my brew after adding it to quarter cup of water. Then allowed last 15 of the boil. I did not see much happen. Cooled transfered at 35 and within an hour in cellar loads of fluffy clouds in the fermenter. Do I leave this or do I need to rack to another bucket? First home user normally just use isinglass at the end pre barrelling.
Did you use a full tablet of Protofloc/Whirlfloc in a standard 23Ltr brew if so that is too much and explains the fluffy cafuffle you are getting. Half a tablet is more than enough.
However it will not cause any harm just hard to get as clean a transfer
 

JockyBrewer

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Did you use a full tablet of Protofloc/Whirlfloc in a standard 23Ltr brew if so that is too much and explains the fluffy cafuffle you are getting. Half a tablet is more than enough.
However it will not cause any harm just hard to get as clean a transfer
Indeed - one tablet is intended to treat up to 100 litres.
 

rekabmit

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The packet said one tablet per 5 gallon, they were squashed so it was part tablet and a bit. Ho Hum. Now it was my take on a London pride tribute. I was concerned with this torified wheat (never knowingly used before) it seemed a little like (sorry for any overseas people that are now confused) Readybrec. Just been to the hot cellar and the cotton wool like aliens seem to be descending. Need to be disciplined and not keep opening to check.
 

rekabmit

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Looking at the various ones on ebay amazon and home brew sites seems there are three sizes. Mine is about the size of pound coin. The ones that say use half tablet look the size of 2pound coin. Or a Crown.
 

RoomWithABrew

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Tend to put whirlfloc or irish moss in the kettle. Clarity ferm in the fermenter and if I think there's an issue or a hurry up needed then Super F by closed transfer to fermenter in the fridge before transfer to keg.
I found Voss and the High pressure lager yeast didn't clear that well.
 

foxy

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So I added a tablet yo my brew after adding it to quarter cup of water. Then allowed last 15 of the boil. I did not see much happen. Cooled transfered at 35 and within an hour in cellar loads of fluffy clouds in the fermenter. Do I leave this or do I need to rack to another bucket? First home user normally just use isinglass at the end pre barrelling.
Again Charlie explains COLD CRASHING around the 41 minute mark. Anyone having trouble with head retention and clarity should really listen to what he says.
 

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