Yeast recovery advice please

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

Swirled up what was left in the FV after my lager (WY2308), transferred it to a sterilised flask, added about the same amount of cooled boiled water and gave it a really good shake.
But instead of stratification I've got something more like egg drop soup.

Doesn't look very promising. Advice please, e.g.:

1. Give it more time to settle;
2. Pour off the clear stuff and pitch the curds;
3. Chuck it and make a starter from what's left in the bottom of the fast ferment test instead (second photo);
4. etc...

Update: after another 30mins standing it looks like this:

 

[An Ankoù]

It looks absolutely fine to me. Pour off the liquor and pitch the rest. If you leave it a few days, it'll settle even more.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

Thanks @An Ankoù

 

[The Baron]

Same as AA.
Thats what I do swirl decant into a sterile/sanitised jar and leave to settle out in the fridge until ready to use then pour off the beer/water

 

[Cestrian]

Agree with all of the above, but you don’t need to “give it a really good shake”. When you have decanted the beer off your brew, you add the preboiled water to the yeast cake and give it a gentle swirl to get the yeast into suspension. You don’t want to oxygenate it at this stage. Then I leave it to settle for 10 minutes, so the dead yeast and any hop debris sink to the bottom, before pouring the good stuff into a sanitised jar. Then store in the fridge until brew day.

saying all that.. I would pitch what you’ve got there into another brew within 2 or 3 weeks. It’ll be fine.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

Thanks all - much appreciated

 

[Slid]

Wow, I am so Middle Ages on this. I just swirl the dregs from the initial FV, pour into a jug, then into some 250ml bottles (lemonade, originally) put them in the fridge, use 1 or 2 perhaps and chuck the rest when the fridge gets a bit full up with obviously stale yeast.

Strangely never had any issues.

 

[The Baron]

Me too Slid
Swirl pour into jars and refrigerate Simples

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

Fair enough! You know what it’s like the first time you do something tho :-)

 

[MashBag]

Me too Slid
Swirl pour into jars and refrigerate Simples

Wassis swirl. Sounds complex

I just tip the lees into a clean bottle after racking the beer out. Fridge or freeze. Sorted.

 

[An Ankoù]

It's good to remember that we're working as cleanly as possible with foodtuffs, in a kitchen environment. We're not culturing precious lifeforms in a sterile laboratory.
Personally, I pitch a new starter or rehydrated sachet and then use the yeasty trub again and perhaps a second generation. They can start tailing off after that, especially with attenuation and clearing. If I've paid good money (£7.95 or more) for a liquid yeast I'll keep some of the bottles behind to reculture the yeast from. This way a yeast can be reused for years and years without going past the second generation.
I've always had a hankering for making up a collection of frozen samples of yeast in a glycerine solution, but I've never had the time or freezer space or need to do so.

 

[The Baron]

I very rarely go beyond 2nd generation too. For me its not just about saving money but I find it easier to pitch from a re-used yeast saved in the fridge( it does seem to start quicker) I also generally go no longer than a month if possible

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

Wassis swirl. Sounds complex

I just tip the lees into a clean bottle after racking the beer out. Fridge or freeze. Sorted.

Simple is good :-)
Even so, I can see the benefit of 'washing' the sediment to get rid of a bit of the old trub and dead cells... and it seems quite a lot of people do it

For interest, take a look at (e.g.) Yeast Washing 101 - Brewer's Friend

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

If I've paid good money (£7.95 or more) for a liquid yeast I'll keep some of the bottles behind to reculture the yeast from. This way a yeast can be reused for years and years without going past the second generation.

Really good point @AA - I always keg my beer, but perhaps this is a good case for sticking the last 'runnings' from the FV into a bottle.

I'm idly wondering why we are happy for a "beer" in a bottle not to need keeping in the fridge - whereas we tend to keep 'sediment from the FV' (@Slid , @the baron et al) refrigerated? Have I got this confused in my head, or other than keeping the air off it (which is easily done either way) and a small amount of secondary fermentation, isn't there very little difference between the two??

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

A while ago I bought a load of PET bottle preforms (like a very thick-walled plastic test tube - as used for 'tilt' hydrometers) and I'm now thinking these would be ideal for keeping 'beer' for yeast re-culturing purposes. They are pressure tight too so they can even be primed, if that's considered to be an important part of the process.

Thoughts?

 

[An Ankoù]

Really good point @AA - I always keg my beer, but perhaps this is a good case for sticking the last 'runnings' from the FV into a bottle.

I'm idly wondering why we are happy for a "beer" in a bottle not to need keeping in the fridge - whereas we tend to keep 'sediment from the FV' (@Slid , @the baron et al) refrigerated? Have I got this confused in my head, or other than keeping the air off it (which is easily done either way) and a small amount of secondary fermentation, isn't there very little difference between the two??

My logic is that if I can buy a bottle conditioned ale that's been hanging around in the supermarket for months or years and culture the yeast from it, then I can culture same from my own bottle that's been stored in the garage. I wouldn't dream of doing it with an unsealed container of tub, though. That goes in the fridge and gets used within a month or two max.
Not sure of the logic here, but will give it some thought.
I use Wyeast Scottish for my mild and I reculture it from a batch of smoked porter that is ghastly to drink (peat smoked malt not a good idea) but the bottles are still good for yeast after 2 years.
I've still got half a dozen 33s of a 7% brew I made with WLP French Ale, a Vaults yeast that I've never seen again. They must be 4 years or more old by now.

 

[An Ankoù]

My logic is that if I can buy a bottle conditioned ale that's been hanging around in the supermarket for months or years and culture the yeast from it, then I can culture same from my own bottle that's been stored in the garage. I wouldn't dream of doing it with an unsealed container of tub, though. That goes in the fridge and gets used within a month or two max.
Not sure of the logic here, but will give it some thought.
I use Wyeast Scottish for my mild and I reculture it from a batch of smoked porter that is ghastly to drink (peat smoked malt not a good idea) but the bottles are still good for yeast after 2 years.
I've still got half a dozen 33s of a 7% brew I made with WLP French Ale, a Vaults yeast that I've never seen again. They must be 4 years or more old by now.

I think it might be a mistake to bottle tub or unduly cloudy beer though. If there's any viable yeast in there it ll culture up. And if it carbonated then there's yeast.

 

[The-Engineer-That-Brews]

I think it might be a mistake to bottle tub or unduly cloudy beer though. If there's any viable yeast in there it ll culture up. And if it carbonated then there's yeast.

Not sure I follow you: surely you want viable yeast in there don't you? Sorry to be dense...

Ah - I think I see what you mean: by bottling pretty clear beer, you aim to ensure there is _only_ viable yeast in there - i.e. minimal trub etc.

I agree it seems best to avoid bottling the trub, but is there a particular reason?

 

[An Ankoù]

Not sure I follow you: surely you want viable yeast in there don't you? Sorry to be dense...

Ah - I think I see what you mean: by bottling pretty clear beer, you aim to ensure there is _only_ viable yeast in there - i.e. minimal trub etc.

I agree it seems best to avoid bottling the trub, but is there a particular reason?

Superstition really. I don't want break proteins and early dead cells in there more than necessary. But don't really know why. I suspect it might promote autolysis. When I harvest yeast from a bought bottle, say, St Austell, I'm using the dregs from ordinary beer. Don't know if it makes a difference. It's just the, way I do it.

 

[MashBag]

Simple is good :-)
Even so, I can see the benefit of 'washing' the sediment to get rid of a bit of the old trub and dead cells... and it seems quite a lot of people do it

People use dead yeast as a nutrient. Can't see the point in washing it out