Quick! Ferment it and drink it before the infection takes hold!

My normal brewing practice is to create a concentrated wort, boil it, then put it in a no chill cube (actually my old coopers FV covered with cling film) then 24-48 hours later dilute the concentrated wort down to target OG then pitch my yeast.

However, this time when it came diluting and pitching I was tired after work so I thought I'd leave it till my next day off, "I'm sure it will be ok", I thought. Which would have meant the concentrated wort would have been in the cube for 5 days. Something I've never done before. On tues or wednesday (day three or four in the cube) I notice the wort was going a bit hazy. So I though "uh oh!"

Yesterday I decide to dilute the wort and pitch the yeast. As soon as I started to open the tap and pour the wort into a bucket (to pour into the FV from a height to aerate) I smelt a yeasty/bready smell. When I lifted the cling film I could also smell a kind of apple juice smell, something I've never smelt with the concentrated wort before. So I'm guessing some wild yeast has started to ferment the wort. It tastes fine, like it normally should and there were no bubble I could see.

I'm free fermenting the brew with MJ work horse yeast. The ambient temp in my kitchen is 25C. The strip thermometer on the side said 28C so that's what it probably is in the FV. I pitched yesterday eve and it was going like the clappers this morning. It's only OG 1.038 so I'm expecting it to be completely fermented out in a week or less.

I've had wild yeast infections previously, and they very slowly ferment all the remaining sugars out of the beer. So if you drink the beer before the infection takes hold, it tastes fine. So I'll bottle it the weekend after next then start drinking it after about three days carbing (done this loads of times with low FG, low IBU pale beers). If I get drunk in 2-3 weeks I'm hoping It will be finished before any infection really takes hold. Well that's the plan anyway

I've no idea if this is the case or not but if your brewing yeast takes hold is it possible that it would starve out any wild yeast and then assuming the wild yeast isn't as alcohol tolerant as the main strain stop it from doing anything further?

Will be interesting to see how it turns out and maybe leave a few bottles a bit longer (although watching for over carbonation) to see if they continue to mature or deteriorate.

Graz said:

I've no idea if this is the case or not but if your brewing yeast takes hold is it possible that it would starve out any wild yeast and then assuming the wild yeast isn't as alcohol tolerant as the main strain stop it from doing anything further?

Will be interesting to see how it turns out and maybe leave a few bottles a bit longer (although watching for over carbonation) to see if they continue to mature or deteriorate.

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The brewing yeast has certainly taken hold and fermenting away crazily. In fact the krausen has now disappeared so it was only their for about 18 hours. As I mentioned in the OP I've had wild yeast infections before. The brewers yeast consuming all the oxygen and nutrients doesn't seem to stop the wild stain from doing anything further. It's just very slow to eventually do it's thing.

Your right It will be interesting to keep a couple of bottles for a few weeks. I dont actually know I've got an infection. I'm just assuming it based on the odd smells of the undiluleted wort. It may nor be infected at all

I hope it turns out ok.
I had a brew that tasted ok on the first test but then after a week or two I tried another and noticed a medicinal taste, so I drank them all quickly, the really strange thing is though, that when I had got down to the last few bottles I had gotten used to it and quite liked it :nono:

Hi myqul, What have your wild yeast brews tasted like? I've had a couple of brews have a weird taste to them which i couldn't pin down to a taste that has been documented.One was from one brew i split into 2 f.v's using different yeasts. Maybe a temp thing. The taste did die down after a few months but still there. Concerning the flat apple juice taste and smell, i've had couple similar with a thin film on top , like an oil slick. Tasted rank in the f.v. Both were english type ales and both turned out superb.

davereal said:

Hi myqul, What have your wild yeast brews tasted like? I've had a couple of brews have a weird taste to them which i couldn't pin down to a taste that has been documented.One was from one brew i split into 2 f.v's using different yeasts. Maybe a temp thing. The taste did die down after a few months but still there. Concerning the flat apple juice taste and smell, i've had couple similar with a thin film on top , like an oil slick. Tasted rank in the f.v. Both were english type ales and both turned out superb.

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It tasted like it should do tbh. Sugary wort with an aftertaste of bitterness from the bittering charge. It's fermenting away at the moment. I'll take a gravity sample and taste it in about a weeks time

Before, i chucked a load down the drain. only to find 1 bottle a year later that had escaped my foot stamping ' that's it, i'm giving up' and was a mighty fine ale . Gutted. As many have said on here before. Stick with buddy.

Very interesting thread, this is.

I did a Brewferm Christmas Ale 7L one can kit brew in February this year and re-used the yeast for a couple of of times. I really did like the effect it has on a beer, using the Belgian yeast.

Only slight downside might be that once you use a very aggressive yeast, it can tend to persist on the brewing equipment. Most of the beers done since the X-mas one have fermented right down to 1.003 to 1.005.

I check (re-calibrate) and re-check the hydrometer each time and it tells me the same rather strange looking story.

At the moment, I don't see this as an issue, as the beers turn out very much to my liking,

As a slight aside, the Xmas brew I did back in Feb, has been "sampled" a few times. The most recent was very gassy indeed. As a "special" brew it is in the Grolsh style bottles I got from the "Range".

Slid said:

Very interesting thread, this is.

I did a Brewferm Christmas Ale 7L one can kit brew in February this year and re-used the yeast for a couple of of times. I really did like the effect it has on a beer, using the Belgian yeast.

Only slight downside might be that once you use a very aggressive yeast, it can tend to persist on the brewing equipment. Most of the beers done since the X-mas one have fermented right down to 1.003 to 1.005.

I check (re-calibrate) and re-check the hydrometer each time and it tells me the same rather strange looking story.

At the moment, I don't see this as an issue, as the beers turn out very much to my liking,

As a slight aside, the Xmas brew I did back in Feb, has been "sampled" a few times. The most recent was very gassy indeed. As a "special" brew it is in the Grolsh style bottles I got from the "Range".

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what did you do to salvage the yeast ?

Well it seemed to have stopped doing anything by late afternoon yesterday so I took a gravity reading this morning. It was 1.012. The target its 1.010 for 75% attenuation so it's nearly fermented out in less than 48 hours :shock: I tasted the gravity sample and it was delicious. Hersbrucker hops are my new favourite hop. I think I'll definately be able to package it next weekend. Then start tucking in 3 days later

Personal91 said:

what did you do to salvage the yeast ?

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I re-use the sediment after racking to secondary, but you would do the same thing if you just bottled from primary.

Basically you leave a fair bit of beer in the bottom of the fermenter, along with the yeast slurry. Mix beer and yeast together by swirling gently.

Around 6x 250ml PET bottles (lemonade) carefully sterilised can be filled, in the sink, via a funnel. With the lids screwed back on, they will keep in the fridge for long enough to brew every other week, so up to 3 months.

As the Xmas Ale is only a 7L brew, I only got 2 bottles of 250ml yeast slurry.

Slid said:

Very interesting thread, this is.

I did a Brewferm Christmas Ale 7L one can kit brew in February this year and re-used the yeast for a couple of of times. I really did like the effect it has on a beer, using the Belgian yeast.

Only slight downside might be that once you use a very aggressive yeast, it can tend to persist on the brewing equipment. Most of the beers done since the X-mas one have fermented right down to 1.003 to 1.005.

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i'd call that your house yeast :-)

I suspect my saison yeast has taken hold in my fv as my last brew after my saison got down to 1..03 although it was a tripel yeast, so I used boiling water on the fv to finish the yeast off.

I feel like a murderer :-( after all the yeast was great just not good for a wheat beer :-?

Well this has had 1 week fermentation and one week in conditioning so I cracked a couple of bottles open and there doesnt appear to be any signs of infection (yet). Its rather nice but very murky/cloudy. I might cold crash a couple of growlers of it for a week to clear it.
Must say I'm quite impressed with the work horse yeast . Considering it fermented at about 28C it's quite clean tasting.

MyQul said:

Well this has had 1 week fermentation and one week in conditioning so I cracked a couple of bottles open and there doesnt appear to be any signs of infection (yet).

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If my recent experiences with infections are anything to go by, you should be fine for a while - mine don't seem to take hold until 10 weeks or so after bottling, and the beer is real tasty up to that point, with no sign that anything is wrong. Then just as I think they're fine they start going to pot

darrellm said:

If my recent experiences with infections are anything to go by, you should be fine for a while - mine don't seem to take hold until 10 weeks or so after bottling, and the beer is real tasty up to that point, with no sign that anything is wrong. Then just as I think they're fine they start going to pot

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Ten weeks!! I'll have made and drunk another 3 brews by then!

Slid said:

I re-use the sediment after racking to secondary, but you would do the same thing if you just bottled from primary.

Basically you leave a fair bit of beer in the bottom of the fermenter, along with the yeast slurry. Mix beer and yeast together by swirling gently.

Around 6x 250ml PET bottles (lemonade) carefully sterilised can be filled, in the sink, via a funnel. With the lids screwed back on, they will keep in the fridge for long enough to brew every other week, so up to 3 months.

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I saved some sediment from an Oud Vlaams beer and added some leftover wort from the next brew to build the yeast up. How much should be used when starting off another brew?

MyQul, I think you got lucky. 1.012 still has sugars and some to most wild yeast strains can go dry eating up sugars that Brewers yeast wouldn't go for. GUSHERS.

JapanBrew said:

MyQul, I think you got lucky. 1.012 still has sugars and some to most wild yeast strains can go dry eating up sugars that Brewers yeast wouldn't go for. GUSHERS.

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It's was actually 1.010 the last gravity reading I took but I hear what your saying. I've had a couple of wild yeast infections before that chewed through virtually all the sugars but it didn't start to show up till about 3-4 weeks +. I'll havedrunk most if not all of the batch by then

I have had a few gushers. I reckon a proper cube would be better. I think i will get one. Heard you can store the wort for a months or more.

Or maybe not for months
Storing Wort Runs the Risk of Botulism http://beerandwinejournal.com/botulism/