Should we be testing mash pH at 45 mins?

[Clarence]

If you read later into the article they say "You can make further adjustments if needed by adding more or the remaining 20% lactic acid."

Yes, but to what end? If I've read this right, it's to correct the beer pH rather than the mash pH as the conversion is pretty much done. I also note that the mash pH is not idealised on extraction, but maximising available nitrogen is also taken into consideration. As I always chuck a teaspoonful of yeast nutrient into fermenter at pitching time, it's this latter anything more than an academic question?
(in the spirit of enquiry, Sadfield, not negativity).
Edit
Beer clarity is also said to be improved at the lower end of the pH range while darker beer prefer the higher limit. I aim for 100 ppm CO3-- for my milds and stouts and they are always crystal clear so there must be other factors at work, too.

 

[Sadfield]

Yes, but to what end?

Like I said, if you read further into the article posted.

"The reason for adding only 80% of acid upfront is to reduce the risk of overshooting your target."

So, to correct the pH if undershot. Given the article is about mash pH, one would have to assume for mashing purposes.

 

[Clarence]

Like I said, if you read further into the article you posted.

"The reason for adding only 80% of acid upfront is to reduce the risk of overshooting your target."

So, to correct the pH if undershot. Given the article is about mash pH, one would have to assume for mashing purposes.

True, all of the article is about mash pH, but this would seem to be at odds with that assumption:

" However, perhaps the most compelling reason for targeting mash pH in the slightly lower range of 5.2–5.6 is best explained by John Palmer in his 2018 Homebrew Con talk, where he notes “Mash pH sets up beer pH" etc.

Another thought.
Since the lower pH favours clarity, colour and presumably stability, isn't a lot of this down to protein coagulation in and after the boil? If that's the case and I'm not setting up a false argument here, wouldnt it be easier to measure the wort pH and correct that before the boil rather than trying to stir lactic acid solution evenly into porridge. Particularly as correction at 45 minutes would seem to make little difference to the dynamics of the mash?

 

[MashBag]

A common occurrence on this forum that actions of those who invest more time, care and effort, are viewed negatively.

I've never seen that anywhere on this forum. On the other hand, it's legitimate to ask whether a particular investment pays any kind of dividend.

I think we all come from different places and are on different journeys.

Some enjoy brewing, some drinking,
some variety brew, some house brew,
some time rich, some poor,

And any combination of the above. But we all make beer, and we all learn from each other.

Me I have never checked my pH (reading this makes me think I should & I can, but but in all honestly I probably won't). I do treat my water.. But not cos I wanted to, I fixed a problem.

I don't sparge either, I don't chill. I don't crash. Because I am very much an effort vs reward sort of thinker. I also think you need to brew a beer a few times to get the best out of it. Excel does not have any taste bud functionality

Nothing negative just different ways.

 

[Clarence]

I think we all come from different places and are on different journeys.

Some enjoy brewing, some drinking,
some variety brew, some house brew,
some time rich, some poor,

And any combination of the above. But we all make beer, and we all learn from each other.

Me I have never checked my pH (reading this makes me think I should & I can, but but in all honestly I probably won't). I do treat my water.. But not cos I wanted to, I fixed a problem.

I don't sparge either, I don't chill. I don't crash. Because I am very much an effort vs reward sort of thinker. I also think you need to brew a beer a few times to get the best out of it. Excel does not have any taste bud functionality

Nothing negative just different ways.

I agree, mash bag, although I do do the things that you leave out except measure pH at various stages. However, in the interests of science, I'm off to riffle my lad's Fisher Price chemistry set of all it's litmus papers and conduct some ground-breaking research.

 

[Sadfield]

True, all of the article is about mash pH, but this would seem to be at odds with that assumption:

" However, perhaps the most compelling reason for targeting mash pH in the slightly lower range of 5.2–5.6 is best explained by John Palmer in his 2018 Homebrew Con talk, where he notes “Mash pH sets up beer pH" etc.

Another thought.
Since the lower pH favours clarity, colour and presumably stability, isn't a lot of this down to protein coagulation in and after the boil? If that's the case and I'm not setting up a false argument here, wouldnt it be easier to measure the wort pH and correct that before the boil rather than trying to stir lactic acid solution evenly into porridge. Particularly as correction at 45 minutes would seem to make little difference to the dynamics of the mash?

Sure mash pH sets up beer pH, and pH can be adjusted at any stage, but mash pH still matters, so It makes sense to set pH as early as possible. Ideally, before dough in, then check in the first 5-15 when adjustments are still possible. The track of pH is all about a line of best fit throughout the entire process, higher pH improves extraction, fermentability, hop utilisation. For total soluble nitrogen, free amino nitrogen and tannin extraction lower pH values are optimal.