The answer to any social problem in the UK? Tax

[Shrek]

It would seem that the government are hell bent on bringing in minimum alcohol prices to try and deter binge drinking. If they do I fear all they will do is drive people to the black market. It is the same with tabacco. It didn't work in the US in the 30's when they banned alcohol and I don't think it will work now. There was a report in the Lincolnshire echo that there has been a rise in illegal stills and kncok off vodka and the people in charge are wondering why.

What are your thoughts on how we can stop the 'curse of binge drinking'?

I believe we should lower the age for drinking low alcohol drinks such as beer to 16 the same as in the Netherlands. You never see people drunk in the street or fighting there and if you did their parents would give them a good clip around the ear.

 

[graysalchemy]

It is a cultural thing interwoven with a much larger social issue, I think it is going to take a lot more than just ramping up the tax. With what has happened over the last 15-20 yrs we have now got a new generation to whom getting rat arsed to the point of being hospitalised is considered a good night out, this undoubtedly will be passed onto the next generation and so on.

You are not going to be able to change our culture over night, but I would agree that exposing young people to sensible drinking as on the continent but unless the parents can be re educated that isn't going to happen.

 

[Vossy1]

What are your thoughts on how we can stop the 'curse of binge drinking'?

Is there a 'curse' or is it media generated :hmm:
How about using some of the tax generated revenue from HMRC to open social clubs which have been closed due to cuts. That would help to get kids off the street where very often the binge drinking culture starts.
Criminal records for those who commit public order issues due to alcohol intake on 2 or more occaisions, funded by revenue generated by HMRC....potential loss of job would be a pretty strong factor to those employed!...Take responsibility for your own actions!

I believe we should lower the age for drinking low alcohol drinks such as beer to 16 the same as in the Netherlands. You never see people drunk in the street or fighting there and if you did their parents would give them a good clip around the ear.

I'd like it to, but it wouldn't work. We have a very different social mentality regards alcohol to other Europeans.
This government aren't serious about binge drinking. Why are they targeting/punishing all drinkers when the problem is caused by a minority...two words...stealth tax :nono:

Gets of high horse :lol:

 

[Hawks]

Totally agree, its a social issue that would prove hard to fix...

Raising taxes etc would just seem a way for HMRC to get more money, but not fix a thing

 

[screamlead]

Should do what they did here - barred anyone under 25 from drinking. If caught severe prison sentence. Here its 10 to a cell and the family have to come every day to feed you too. No cushy quilts or iphone just hard labour!!
The way it should be!! :thumb:

 

[Shrek]

I was brought up with having a glass of wine with meals on a sunday or the odd pint here or there with my dad when I was young and it never did me any harm. There was an argument in the papers saying that it is because we are told to act like idiots when we drink by anti drink adverts and tv shows that is why people do it. They gave people alcohol free beer and they behaved the same way by being agressive and acting like idiots. Alcohol is not the root cause of the problem but it does have some part to play and people use it as an excuse to act in an improper manner. I hate it when they get a lighter court sentence becuase they are addicted to drink or drugs. It should be one rule for all and as screamlead said a proper prison not daycare.

 

[alphacento]

I think that having a minimum price for Alcohol would be a good idea, not just to deter binge drinking, but also to stop supermarket selling awful beers at incredibly cheap prices. Minimum beer price in Supermarket will hopefully bring back more people to the pub and also get them to buy more traditional/local beers.

 

[The Ginger Ninja]

I would get rid of all 'Pound a Pint' nights and other student type deals. When its cheaper then a pint of coke somethings wrong.

 

[Swift Pint]

I would get rid of all 'Pound a Pint' nights and other student type deals. When its cheaper then a pint of coke somethings wrong.

Its worse for spirits. When I was a student a few years ago I remember some of the bars selling trebles and a mixer for £2.... now thats just crazy.

 

[Vossy1]

I think that having a minimum price for Alcohol would be a good idea, not just to deter binge drinking, but also to stop supermarket selling awful beers at incredibly cheap prices

It would also stop real ale from being sold at reasonable prices, and the cheaper **** would still be err...cheaper. That would reduce competition and probably put a huge strain on some micros :cry:

As an 'aside' there are more folk suffering with obesity in the U.K, and the health problems associated with it, than there are binge drinkers....why's chocolate not being viewed in the same light, it's all about moderation :hmm:

 

[oz11]

Minimum pricing *shouldn't* affect the prices of beers sold in the on-trade. At a level, say, of around 50p per unit, that would put the minimum price of a pint 3.5%-5.0% beer in the range of around £1.00 - £1.50*. Of course, once the minimum has been set and it gets inflated with each passing year, then it might well be the thin of the wedge!

camra statement

*Estimated figures

 

[Shrek]

I have never joined camra becuase they have teamed up with J D Wetherspoon. As I see it J D Wetherspoon do a lot for shifting ale from microbreweries but also price their beer cheaper than the local free houses and for camra to team up with them seems a strange bedfellow. Next they will be teaming up with tesco as they sell a range of bottled real ale.

 

[alphacento]

It would also stop real ale from being sold at reasonable prices

If taxes are raised on all brews then yes. If a minimum price is introduced that would not have much of an effect on real ale and microbreweries as their prices are already higher than the cheap lager sold in the supermarkets.

 

[Vossy1]

If a minimum price is introduced that would not have much of an effect on real ale and microbreweries as their prices are already higher than the cheap lager sold in the supermarkets

Minimum pricing *shouldn't* affect the prices of beers sold in the on-trade.

I tend to buy my beers 4 for £5, or whatever offer's on, with the new tax these sorts of offers will be a thing of the past :cry: ...when was the last time you saw a binge drinker of bottled real ale causing problems

 

[critch]

I think that having a minimum price for Alcohol would be a good idea, not just to deter binge drinking, but also to stop supermarket selling awful beers at incredibly cheap prices

It would also stop real ale from being sold at reasonable prices, and the cheaper **** would still be err...cheaper. That would reduce competition and probably put a huge strain on some micros :cry:

naah,40p-50p a unit end sale price. its not supposed to affect producers /wholesalers side, but at the (supermarket)tills where joe blogs buys his slab of stella illtwatya and 3 bottles of zepplin for 15 quid

what'll put more strain on micros is the gradual erosion of progressive beer duty by this government, mark my words theres going to be a few shutdowns this year

 

[critch]

vossy it is not a tax! i run a micro(with others!) and from what weve been told by siba and other industry bodies (and what weve researched ourselves) this wont affect us. bogof's and 4 for 5 deals in supermarkets are always swallowed by the micros supplying 'em anyway, one of the reasons why i (and a growing number of micros) wont deal with them, rather supply independant bottleshops and good internet retailers. only supermarket ill consider is booths

40p is whats being bandied round .most of your bottled real ales will be under 3 units ergo 1.20 a bottle so 4 for fives will still be doable on most of the bottled **** you get in supermarkets........

whether itll come out like that after the supermarkets start bleating is another thing.

 

[Vossy1]

Have I misunderstood the idea...I though it was proposed there would be a minimum charge imposed by the government per unit/units of alcohol :hmm:...off to have a look.

EDIT

40p is whats being bandied round .most of your bottled real ales will be under 3 units ergo 1.20 a bottle so 4 for fives will still be doable on most of the bottled **** you get in supermarkets......

With you now, that'll teach me to skim read ...I wait to see :pray:

 

[brizleciderarmy]

Should do what they did here - barred anyone under 25 from drinking. If caught severe prison sentence. Here its 10 to a cell and the family have to come every day to feed you too. No cushy quilts or iphone just hard labour!!
The way it should be!! :thumb:

Couldn't agree more with that. The penal system in this country is a joke! But that is for another discussion.


Binge drinking 'itself' isn't the problem its the result of it. The antisocial activities related to binge drinking are one of the big issues and steps towards sorting that out would be a huge start.

For example:
I could go out tonight and get absolutely ratarsed. On the way home i could **** up a shop door, chuck the remainder of my doner at the back of someones head which results in an altercation with an innocent member of public. I could then proceed to punching that innocent person then go off on my merry way smashing car wing mirrors as i go.

IF i get arrested for my little rampage, 9 times out of 10 the worst i would be looking at is a night in a cell and a cup of watery tea in the morning. If i ask politely they would even give me a little rubber toothbrush. After 15 minutes in an interview room i would be let go only to do the same next week. Even if it did go to court i would most likely get off with a fine or wait for it, Community Service. 30 hours of digging cabbages. Not good enough.

Too many **** stains get away with this on a nightly basis and even though it shouldn't, it really gets on my ****. When i see all the dickheads on these police programs causing trouble in the high street it makes my blood boil. Its high time this aspect of binge drinking was cut out and even if it means getting a 30day stretch for stealing a traffic cone while drunk then so be it.

Don't get me wrong i am no saint, i always got regularly hammered in my younger days but i never got abusive or damaged property. I'm all for people having a good time when they get whammered, just not at society's expense.

It doesn't matter what campaigns/advertisements/propaganda you see regarding the health problems resulting from binge drinking, the government couldn't care less about our healths. They can tax alcohol all they want ( and they will given its one of their biggest earners) but it wont make a blind bit of difference.

 

[critch]

With you now, that'll teach me to skim read ...I wait to see :pray:

Yeah if it comes through like this it could be quite positive for the pub trade......if..........

 

[Darcey]

It would depend how the 'minimum' price is implemented. The brewery I work for is currently struggling to keep prices stable with increases in fuel, energy AND beer duty. I suspect that most brewerys would increase their prices slightly given the minimum price banding. For instance the brewery I work for in Manchester is always known as the 'cheapest' pint (apart from Sam Smiths), their lowest price branding puts a pint at £1.40 during the Monday 'happy' hour. For due diligence and YOY increase in costs as well as duty I would assume that the whole pricing structure would be hoiked up by 10p to keep a clean margin. So the most expensive pubs would be come... slightly more expensive to keep the banding format in place. This is not an obvious or mandatory response but family brewerys like to keep it simple and I can see this being a simple if not obvious response.