Ashbeck

[strange-steve]

It's mostly for pseudo lagers, bitter and not that hoppy pale ales ( IBU about 30). Here's my thames water report. Not actually that usefull https://secure.thameswater.co.uk/water-quality-reports/2015 WQ Report_Z0112_peckham.pdf
I've ust testied the alkalinity of my water it came out at 208ppm

I stuck those figures into Bru'n Water and for a bitter or pale ale about 0.1g/l of gypsum would be enough. If you don't have jewelry scales to measure that it's about half a teaspoon per 20 litres, added both to the mash water and the sparge water. At that rate you'll have a decent amount of calcium and a good chloride:sulphate ratio. You could add a bit more if you like, it wouldn't do any harm. You'll also need to add enough CRS to remove about 170 ppm alkalinity, which according to the manufacturer is about 0.9ml/l. This should give a mash pH within the desired range even with a 100% pale malt grist.

 

[rubby]

It's a normal brew which can take a bit more that i expected.

 

[MyQul]

I stuck those figures into Bru'n Water and for a bitter or pale ale about 0.1g/l of gypsum would be enough. If you don't have jewelry scales to measure that it's about half a teaspoon per 20 litres, added both to the mash water and the sparge water. At that rate you'll have a decent amount of calcium and a good chloride:sulphate ratio. You could add a bit more if you like, it wouldn't do any harm. You'll also need to add enough CRS to remove about 170 ppm alkalinity, which according to the manufacturer is about 0.9ml/l. This should give a mash pH within the desired range even with a 100% pale malt grist.

Thanks a lot for this steve :hat: I tried downloading bru n water once and it fried my head.

I have jewellers scales so can measure the gypsum accurately.
So none is needed for the boil? or would puting about the same amount of half a teaspoonful in the boil not be necessary/do no harm/cause problems

 

[strange-steve]

Thanks a lot for this steve :hat: I tried downloading bru n water once and it fried my head.

I have jewellers scales so can measure the gypsum accurately.
So none is needed for the boil? or would puting about the same amount of half a teaspoonful in the boil not be necessary/do no harm/cause problems

Some say to add the salts into the dry grist before doughing in and also into the boil but Bru'n Water suggests adding them to the mash water before heating to strike temp and likewise with the sparge water. So because all of the water has been treated it's not necessary to add to the boil.

Bru'n Water can be a bit overwhelming at first but it's definitely worth sticking with it. Have another play about with it, plug in what figures you have from your water report and use about 80 ppm for Ca and 15 ppm for Mg (these are approximations because they aren't on the report but should be pretty close).

 

[MyQul]

Some say to add the salts into the dry grist before doughing in and also into the boil but Bru'n Water suggests adding them to the mash water before heating to strike temp and likewise with the sparge water. So because all of the water has been treated it's not necessary to add to the boil.

Bru'n Water can be a bit overwhelming at first but it's definitely worth sticking with it. Have another play about with it, plug in what figures you have from your water report and use about 80 ppm for Ca and 15 ppm for Mg (these are approximations because they aren't on the report but should be pretty close).

Thats the next question I was going to ask. About adding the salts to the grist.

I'll definatley have another go with Bru n water now as previously, when I just plugged numbers o the spreadsheet in I didn't know what I was doing so consequently didn't know whether the figures it spat out were correct or not. Now that youv'e given me what the figures should be I should have a better idea of what I'm doing.

and apologies to @cqr for hijacking your thread. Hopefully all the great info steve has provided will help you too :thumb:

 

[Cqr]

Thats the next question I was going to ask. About adding the salts to the grist.

I'll definatley have another go with Bru n water now as previously, when I just plugged numbers o the spreadsheet in I didn't know what I was doing so consequently didn't know whether the figures it spat out were correct or not. Now that youv'e given me what the figures should be I should have a better idea of what I'm doing.

and apologies to @cqr for hijacking your thread. Hopefully all the great info steve has provided will help you too :thumb:

It's never a hijack, just a little more info :

 

[MyQul]

Some say to add the salts into the dry grist before doughing in and also into the boil but Bru'n Water suggests adding them to the mash water before heating to strike temp and likewise with the sparge water. So because all of the water has been treated it's not necessary to add to the boil.

Bru'n Water can be a bit overwhelming at first but it's definitely worth sticking with it. Have another play about with it, plug in what figures you have from your water report and use about 80 ppm for Ca and 15 ppm for Mg (these are approximations because they aren't on the report but should be pretty close).

Been playing about with Bru n water and EZ water calculators this arvo think I'm starting to get the hand of things. Where did you get the 80ppm for Ca and 15ppm for Mg from?

What do you think if using acid malt to lower mash ph rather than acid (CRS)?

 

[strange-steve]

Been playing about with Bru n water and EZ water calculators this arvo think I'm starting to get the hand of things. Where did you get the 80ppm for Ca and 15ppm for Mg from?

What do you think if using acid malt to lower mash ph rather than acid (CRS)?

If you multiply the alkalinity by 0.4 it gives a rough estimate as to the Ca level. It is only approximate but it will get you started. If you get into water treatment proper I recommend getting the Salifert Ca kit. For Mg I just adjusted it until it balanced, so again it's just an approximation but magnesium isn't something you generally need to worry about.

I've never actually used acid malt but it's basically pale malt coated with lactic acid and I think as long as you keep it no more than about 3% of the grain bill there shouldn't be any flavour from it.

 

[MyQul]

If you multiply the alkalinity by 0.4 it gives a rough estimate as to the Ca level. It is only approximate but it will get you started. If you get into water treatment proper I recommend getting the Salifert Ca kit. For Mg I just adjusted it until it balanced, so again it's just an approximation but magnesium isn't something you generally need to worry about.

I've never actually used acid malt but it's basically pale malt coated with lactic acid and I think as long as you keep it no more than about 3% of the grain bill there shouldn't be any flavour from it.

I thought that multiplying the alkalinity by 0.4 give the estimated Ca level - it says to do this on the brupaks water treatment page

Thanks once again :hat:

 

[Ale]

Ive used tap water for most of my beers, but maybe thats why it has a bit of twang. I live near the south coast where the water has a lot of chalk. I have tried a camden tab once and didnt notice a difference and bottled water once (sainsburys cheap stuff) and again didnt notice much difference. Will it improve my beer a lot if I go down the water testing and improving route?

My next brew will be my first AG and Im looking at doing a 4.5l brew using a 5l shop water (topped up with tap water for the boil) and using the empty bottle as the FV.

 

[strange-steve]

Ive used tap water for most of my beers, but maybe thats why it has a bit of twang. I live near the south coast where the water has a lot of chalk. I have tried a camden tab once and didnt notice a difference and bottled water once (sainsburys cheap stuff) and again didnt notice much difference. Will it improve my beer a lot if I go down the water testing and improving route?

My next brew will be my first AG and Im looking at doing a 4.5l brew using a 5l shop water (topped up with tap water for the boil) and using the empty bottle as the FV.

Water treatment other than adding campden isn't required for kit beers, it'll make no difference so just use tap water. That twang is pretty much unavoidable with lots of kits, but it won't be there in your AG brew.

For your first AG I would just use your tap water with a campden tab. There are lots of much more important things to get right before worrying about the water.

That being said, if you really want to go down that dark road here are some general guidelines based on using Tesco Ashbeck water:

For a light hoppy beer such as an APA add 0.25g/L of gypsum and 0.1g/L calcium chloride.

For a more balanced beer like an English bitter add 0.2g/L of gypsum and 0.15g/L calcium chloride

For a dark malty beer like an oatmeal stout add 0.05g/L of gypsum, 0.25g/L calcium chloride and 0.1g/L of baking soda (baking soda in mash water only)