Ulez expanded to include whole of outer London

[Brew_DD2]

Encourage the poorer people you mean. The rich can and will carry on polluting as either their vehicles are compliant (but often still polluting) or they can afford to pay the tax!

It's *****, but it was ever thus. People at the bottom are always disproportionately affected by these sorts of taxes (beer, wine, petrol, you name it). The likelihood is that most people with a bit of money in their pocket will already have compliant cars.

That's why the support part of it is important.

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

I’ve been travelling into London to work for over 35 years now. Originally five days a week by motorcycle and now two days a week by car. I have seen the introduction of the Congestion Charge zone in central London, then the LEZ and then the ULEZ. The boundary of the ULEZ has moved further outwards twice in that time too. And, trust me, there are no fewer cars on the roads in London now than there were back then. Quite the opposite.

 

[Brew_DD2]

I’ve been travelling into London to work for over 35 years now. Originally five days a week by motorcycle and now two days a week by car. I have seen the introduction of the Congestion Charge zone in central London, then the LEZ and then the ULEZ. The boundary of the ULEZ has moved further outwards twice in that time too. And, trust me, there are no fewer cars on the roads in London now than there were back then. Quite the opposite.

And they may never achieve that, until they start charging all ICE cars. I'd imagine that will come eventually. Presumably air quality has improved in central London?

 

[Chippy_Tea]

As has been discussed somethings have to be taken slowly, it is a drag about the ULEZ, but can you imagine the riots if all non compliant just banned?

Do you think its fair that those that can afford to pay £250 a month to pollute the air can continue to do so while those that cannot have to find other means of getting to work, appointments etc?

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

Presumably air quality has improved in central London?

I haven’t seen any data but I very much doubt it. There are just more cars on the roads regardless of the charges, which is the point I’m trying to make.
In addition, there are fewer roads for cars now. Eg, Marylebone Road which runs around the north side (just outside) the Congestion Charge zone) had three lanes for motor vehicles. It now has just one. The other two are a dedicated bus and a dedicated cycle lane. I know this seems like a great green initiative but it just causes more congestion and subsequently, due to cars sitting in longer traffic jams, even more pollution.

 

[stripeyjoe]

I haven’t seen any data but I very much doubt it. There are just more cars on the roads regardless of the charges, which is the point I’m trying to make.
In addition, there are fewer roads for cars now. Eg, Marylebone Road which runs around the north side (just outside) the Congestion Charge zone) had three lanes for motor vehicles. It now has just one. The other two are a dedicated bus and a dedicated cycle lane. I know this seems like a great green initiative but it just causes more congestion and subsequently, due to cars sitting in longer traffic jams, even more pollution.

Drive to your local station and catch a train rather than clogging up the roads then!

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

Drive to your local station and catch a train rather than clogging up the roads then!

My commute is a 60 mile round trip. Are you seriously saying I should pay £10.00 per day parking at my local station then £23.00 return for the train ticket instead the of £1.25 a day it costs me in electricity for the same journey in my car? Get real!

 

[stripeyjoe]

instead the of £1.25 a day it costs me in electricity for the same journey in my car

Well, I'd have thought you would be in favour of the ULEZ as it will reduce the amount of fumes you have to breath in... Don't moan about traffic if you are part of the traffic.

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

I’m not against clean air, I don’t think anyone is. I don’t agree with the charge. Basically because it won’t fix the problem.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Drive to your local station and catch a train rather than clogging up the roads then!

My commute is a 60 mile round trip. Are you seriously saying I should pay £10.00 per day parking at my local station then £23.00 return for the train ticket instead the of £1.25 a day it costs me in electricity for the same journey in my car? Get real!

 

[lancon]

I’ve been travelling into London to work for over 35 years now. Originally five days a week by motorcycle and now two days a week by car. I have seen the introduction of the Congestion Charge zone in central London, then the LEZ and then the ULEZ. The boundary of the ULEZ has moved further outwards twice in that time too. And, trust me, there are no fewer cars on the roads in London now than there were back then. Quite the opposite.

The congestion charge reduced traffic initially considerably, since then cars stayed reduced but light commercial (amazon& & etc?) increased to keep it at original levels.
https://www.oecd.org/climate-action...n-charge-and-its-low-emission-zones-c6cd48e9/
And if I were you I would get bike, train and bike, easiest, quickest and good for you.

 

[DaleMC]

I live here. Still way too many cars where I am. They're largely unnecessary. Especially as we have ZipCar and similar. We need to make driving the least attractive option in cities.

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

And if I were you I would get bike, train and bike, easiest, quickest and good for you.

So you’d spend god knows how much on a bike and then an extra £20 odd a day? I’m not sure you would.

 

[stripeyjoe]

I’m not against clean air, I don’t think anyone is. I don’t agree with the charge. Basically because it won’t fix the problem.

So, a 21% reduction in nitrogen dioxide (NO2) concentrations in inner London and a 46% reduction in central London since the ULEZ was introduced and initially expanded isn’t going some way to fixing the problem?

Studies also show that, as a car driver, you’re exposed to more NO2 and particulate pollution than cyclists and pedestrians.
https://www.london.gov.uk/publications/vehicle-exposure-traffic-and-road-generated-air-pollution

 

[Hoppopotamus]

Nah, that's not true. Not once when visiting London have I ever had to pay a ULEZ charge. There's plenty of ways to visit London without incurring a ULEZ charge. The two cars I have access to, a 1972 VW Beetle and a 10+ year old Citroen C3 both meet the ULEZ standards and so no charges would be incurred for either. My motorbike also meets ULEZ standards. Or you could go by train. Or by plane. Or by boat. Or by bus. You won't pay a penny in ULEZ charges.

As for "most of the rest of the country does not even have viable public transport let alone subsidies", I think you can look at 13 years of Tory "governing" to blame for that.

Not that I have any love for the Tories, (or any of the others for that matter), but after 13 years of Tory government we have EXACTLY the same public transport we had at the end of 10+ years of Labour. Governments of ALL parties are London-centric

 

[lancon]

So you’d spend god knows how much on a bike and then an extra £20 odd a day? I’m not sure you would.

Why £20 ? You're going to cycle part of it, will be less. Current bike was £100, done 1000s of miles on it.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Why £20 ? You're going to cycle part of it, will be less. Current bike was £100, done 1000s of miles on it.

As he said in his post below it only costs him £1.25 why would he want to buy a cycle then buy a train ticket every day when he can travel so cheaply?

My commute is a 60 mile round trip. Are you seriously saying I should pay £10.00 per day parking at my local station then £23.00 return for the train ticket instead the of £1.25 a day it costs me in electricity for the same journey in my car? Get real!

 

[lancon]

As he said in his post below it only costs him £1.25 why would he want to buy a cycle then buy a train ticket every day when he can travel so cheaply?

£1.25 seems remarkably cheap looking at prices given online.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

£1.25 seems remarkably cheap looking at prices given online.

Does that include home charging?

 

[lancon]

30p/kw home charge