which demijohn?

[hondac90]

Hi Guys,

I get the impression there won't be a simple answer to this, but want to judge opinion.

I've been brewing beer kits in a 23lt demijohn from Wilko with an air lock in the top. The other day while in my LHBS I reached for a similar demijohn and mentioned it was for a beer kit, I was given some advice to use a bucket and cover the top with a tea towel.

As I know nothing, I followed the advice.

In fact I put two beer kits on and the one in the bucket finished in 7 days and the one in the Wilko demijohn (without an air lock) which took some extra time. They were put on one after another and placed next to each other, as much the same time and place as you can get.

To the question, does the bucket aid fermentation as it has a wider base? Does the absence of the airlock matter? That's a leading question as, the 'wine' demijohn had a bit of mould around the top 14 days later (when I was able to check it). I've moved the (mouldy) beer to a keg, should I have? Is the presence of mould due to time or another factor?

Moving forward, should I aim to use a bucket and tea towel for beer?

 

[cornyandy]

Okay lets try and help you here. A demijohn is a glass jar usually 1 gallon in volume, I am going to assume you are talking about 23 litre plastic fermenters here (not being picky with you just making sure)

So basically you don't need to have beer fermenting under airlock although there is nothing wrong with dong so. Covering it with a towel rather than the lid is asking for infection though I would not do it. I would try not to worry this time about a little mould around the top, if you have what I suspect as a fermenter you would be unlucky if mould spores have got past the rubber O ring that seals the fermenter. I hope you gave it a good wipe before you transferred it.

I think most beer makers use a bucket without an airlock in the to for a fermentation vessel. Honestly I'm not sure of any technical difference other than as a Yorkshire man the bucket type is cheaper

 

[stevej]

Okay lets try and help you here. A demijohn is a glass jar usually 1 gallon in volume, I am going to assume you are talking about 23 litre plastic fermenters here (not being picky with you just making sure)

So basically you don't need to have beer fermenting under airlock although there is nothing wrong with dong so. Covering it with a towel rather than the lid is asking for infection though I would not do it. I would try not to worry this time about a little mould around the top, if you have what I suspect as a fermenter you would be unlucky if mould spores have got past the rubber O ring that seals the fermenter. I hope you gave it a good wipe before you transferred it.

I think most beer makers use a bucket without an airlock in the to for a fermentation vessel. Honestly I'm not sure of any technical difference other than as a Yorkshire man the bucket type is cheaper

I have a friend that has a micro brewery he brews 500ltrs at a time he covers with wet towels :shock:

 

[cornyandy]

I have a friend that has a micro brewery he brews 500ltrs at a time he covers with wet towels :shock:

In a Microbrewery where health and safety, food hygiene and public safety issues are legally dealt with I might even go for an open ferment. In a domestic kitchen I want the wort covered up

 

[hondac90]

Okay lets try and help you here. A demijohn is a glass jar usually 1 gallon in volume, I am going to assume you are talking about 23 litre plastic fermenters here (not being picky with you just making sure)

So basically you don't need to have beer fermenting under airlock although there is nothing wrong with dong so. Covering it with a towel rather than the lid is asking for infection though I would not do it. I would try not to worry this time about a little mould around the top, if you have what I suspect as a fermenter you would be unlucky if mould spores have got past the rubber O ring that seals the fermenter. I hope you gave it a good wipe before you transferred it.

I think most beer makers use a bucket without an airlock in the to for a fermentation vessel. Honestly I'm not sure of any technical difference other than as a Yorkshire man the bucket type is cheaper

I was referring to a 23 litre plastic 'thing', I will now try to refer to this as a fermenter, thank you for pointing out the difference.

Regarding covering it with a tea towel. I had put the lid on it, and the tea towel was covering the small hole an airlock would go through on the bucket, and the hole the bung would go in on the fermenter.

As a fellow Yorkshire man, I was expecting the LHBS to be recommending more expensive kit, but they were the same price. Living the dream...


Cheers

 

[hondac90]

I have a friend that has a micro brewery he brews 500ltrs at a time he covers with wet towels :shock:

maybe my tea towel was too dry, lol

 

[stevej]

In a Microbrewery where health and safety, food hygiene and public safety issues are legally dealt with I might even go for an open ferment. In a domestic kitchen I want the wort covered up

Sorry but even in them environments theres still wild yeast issues?

 

[clibit]

I think both of your FVs are fine but I'd have a lid on the bucket. The hole possibly needs blocking more effectively. Tape something over it. Foil or plastic perhaps.

 

[hondac90]

In a Microbrewery where health and safety, food hygiene and public safety issues are legally dealt with I might even go for an open ferment. In a domestic kitchen I want the wort covered up

I saw open fermentation in a small brewery in czech, it was amazing. I had only just started home brewing at the time and quickly realised that there's more to it than poring cans into a fermenter and filling it with water.

If you get the chance purkmistr (http://www.purkmistr.cz) is well worth the visit

 

[stevej]

I saw open fermentation in a small brewery in czech, it was amazing. I had only just started home brewing at the time and quickly realised that there's more to it than poring cans into a fermenter and filling it with water.

If you get the chance purkmistr (http://www.purkmistr.cz) is well worth the visit

OH the Czech Republic brings back memories :-P

The wife ended that sadly

 

[hondac90]

Sorry but even in them environments theres still wild yeast issues?

sorry, what do you mean? it's only Huddersfield, not that wild

 

[MyQul]

The shape of a fermenter can in fact have an effect on fermentation. So your bucket and 'demijohn' sitting next to each other may have have different temperature variations/hot spot in the wort to one another. Especially if you don't use a brew fridge, your Fv's/demijohn's aresuseptible to ambient temperature differences/swings. So this may account for the difference in time it took to ferment.

 

[MyQul]

sorry, what do you mean? it's only Huddersfield, not that wild

:rofl:

That's unintentionally v.funny

 

[cornyandy]

Eh watch it you know about the cow that like it's udders feeled

 

[MyQul]

Covering it with a towel rather than the lid is asking for infection though I would not do it.

Personally I don't see much difference. They both stop microbes and fruit flies getting into your wort. As long as the krausen doesn't touch the towel I think you'd be fine. I don't use a lid I use cling film. Nowadays I sanitise it with star san to make sure but when I first started doing it I didn't bother.

 

[stevej]

Eh watch it you know about the cow that like it's udders feeled

Sorry Andy im not with you, would you like to explain?

 

[hondac90]

Sorry Andy im not with you, would you like to explain?

it's a music (mac lads) reference, also 'made of ale'.

Did that get you out of it Andy?

 

[stevej]

In short :nah:

 

[stevej]

Here is a link for all that has not bothered to read

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=54951

Regards

Steve

 

[hondac90]

The shape of a fermenter can in fact have an effect on fermentation. So your bucket and 'demijohn' sitting next to each other may have have different temperature variations/hot spot in the wort to one another. Especially if you don't use a brew fridge, your Fv's/demijohn's aresuseptible to ambient temperature differences/swings. So this may account for the difference in time it took to ferment.

I did suspect there would/could be a subtitle difference based on the shape, in addition if one was slightly warmer the yeast could have reacted quicker and raised the temp. etc...

With not having much experience it's difficult to know where the easy wins or the big pitfalls are. From what I'm seeing this isn't a huge issue, or something that's holding me back.