An introduction, and too many questions from a newby!

[drf]

I've been drinking real ale for years, and have for ages had half an intention to try brewing my own. Knowing me rather well, my wife was pretty sure I'd never actually get round to it so as a surprise Father's Day present she's bought me some kit, bless her. There's no way I'd be able to leave it lying around so there's a newby on the forum asking for advice! This might be a bit long, but any pieces of advice gratefully received!

I have a 25l fermentation vessel, airlock, syphon, some steriliser (VWP) and a Young's Harvset Yorkshire Bitter kit.
I will buy a pressure vessel, a hydrometer and a thermometer. I've also been doing some reading in the past (the CAMRA Brew Your Own British Real Ale book, which has been very informative).
In the (far?) future I'd like to give malt extract brewing a go, but for the present there's no possibility of having a big boiler so I'll be sticking with kits.

Some questions:

- I was wondering whether sterilising the cold tap water was required, I've been advised elsewhere to stick a portion of a Campbell tablet in as both a steriliser and also chlorine removal agent. Is it it OK to do this in the fermentation vessel (i.e. the chlorine isn't going to end up in a precipitate or anything is it?)

- Aeration of the wort: since I'll be using unboiled tap water as the bulk of the liquor I assume I won't need to specifically aerate? I'll be having to pour the water from a pan into the FV anyway, so it'll probably get a bit more air in it then (should I sterilise the pan, or will the Campden tablet sort that out anyway?)

- Dissolving the kit ingredients: is there any harm in boiling this for a bit to ensure sterility, or is it better just to get it dissolved into some pre-boiled, hot water?

- The kit instructions use added sugar, I was intending to use some spraymalt instead of household sugar as I reckon this'll be more flavoursome

- I'm considering making a yeast starter culture to ensure a rapid onset of fermentation and to check the yeast is OK. I might as well use the yeast that comes in the kit (assuming there's some in there, I haven't opened the tin yet!). It might be of interest to use a different one, the CAMRA book notes that Safale-O4 is a fool-proof beginners' yeast but a bit lacking in character. They also mention Danstar Windsor. I might be tempted to try recovering some from a bottle, since I'll be making a starter anyway, but maybe that's not a great idea to start with!

- I think I will get a hydrometer, I'm a scientist by trade and will enjoy seeing the progress of the fermentation and getting an idea of the ABV!

- Casking: I need to get a cask. My gut feeling is to get a cheapish one, with the possibility of upgrading in the future. Is it worth thinking about getting one with a valve for gassing it to help get the beer out after some has been drunk, without getting too much air in?

- Bottling: I'd quite like to be able to bottle some as well, as drinking it all in one go might be a bit of a challenge. Ideally I'd take a few bottles worth off after it's been in the cask for a while, but I'm not sure that'll be easy without aerating the beer in the bottle (since there'll just be the standard tap on it, but I should be able to get a piece of tubing into the nozzle I suppose), and letting air into the cask. Perhaps for the first batch I'm better off just casking it and seeing how it turns out?

That's it for now I think, it's got quite long enough already!!

Thanks in advance.

Chris

 

[ano]

- I was wondering whether sterilising the cold tap water was required, I've been advised elsewhere to stick a portion of a Campbell tablet in as both a steriliser and also chlorine removal agent. Is it it OK to do this in the fermentation vessel (i.e. the chlorine isn't going to end up in a precipitate or anything is it?)

The threshold of potable water is so low that it can be treated as sterile, I seem to recall it has less living in it than bottled water.
I forget the equation but I think the chlorine (and another thing called chloramine which can react with malt extract and be nasty tasting) reacts with the sodium metabisulphite (campden) and is released as a gas, so it's fine in the FV. But it must be added to the water before you add the kit.

- Aeration of the wort: since I'll be using unboiled tap water as the bulk of the liquor I assume I won't need to specifically aerate? I'll be having to pour the water from a pan into the FV anyway, so it'll probably get a bit more air in it then (should I sterilise the pan, or will the Campden tablet sort that out anyway?)

You should sanitise the pan as Campden isn't a very effective steriliser (it's particularly useless against gram negative bacteria such as acetobacter which turns alcohol into vinegar). It wouldn't hurt to give the wort a whip up with a long spoon, but you're right it will probably be alright.

- Dissolving the kit ingredients: is there any harm in boiling this for a bit to ensure sterility, or is it better just to get it dissolved into some pre-boiled, hot water?

Do you mean boiling the actul extract with some water? Sugar and the kit should be fairly sterile to be honest but there are rumoured to be other benefits in boiling the kit, I forget because I never boiled my kits and they turned out fine.

- The kit instructions use added sugar, I was intending to use some spraymalt instead of household sugar as I reckon this'll be more flavoursome

Agreed

- I'm considering making a yeast starter culture to ensure a rapid onset of fermentation and to check the yeast is OK. I might as well use the yeast that comes in the kit (assuming there's some in there, I haven't opened the tin yet!). It might be of interest to use a different one, the CAMRA book notes that Safale-O4 is a fool-proof beginners' yeast but a bit lacking in character. They also mention Danstar Windsor. I might be tempted to try recovering some from a bottle, since I'll be making a starter anyway, but maybe that's not a great idea to start with!

S-04 is excellent in my opinion althogh my last batch was a little slow to get going. Rehydrating or making a starter will decrease this 'lag' time as you correctly say.

I'm biased towards bottling (I'm in the minority on here I think) so don't know about the casks sorry.

Finally some may pick you up on your use of the word 'sterilise'. In the home it's difficult to get a completely sterile surface (without burning it or an autoclave), you can only do your best by sanitising the equipment, that is reducing the microbial organisms to such a level as to be insignificant. Sterility would be complete removal, which is unecessary anyway.

Good luck though and enjoy it!

 

[jamesb]

Hi Chris, it was me who found your message on rec.crafts.brewing

I've been drinking real ale for years, and have for ages had half an intention to try brewing my own. Knowing me rather well, my wife was pretty sure I'd never actually get round to it so as a surprise Father's Day present she's bought me some kit, bless her. There's no way I'd be able to leave it lying around so there's a newby on the forum asking for advice! This might be a bit long, but any pieces of advice gratefully received!

There's a HOWTO here on how to make the most of your beer kit.

- I was wondering whether sterilising the cold tap water was required, I've been advised elsewhere to stick a portion of a Campbell tablet in as both a steriliser and also chlorine removal agent. Is it it OK to do this in the fermentation vessel (i.e. the chlorine isn't going to end up in a precipitate or anything is it?)

The campden tablet won't sterilise the water (although it does produce a bit of sulphur dioxide, but I suspect this is of negligible use).

- Aeration of the wort: since I'll be using unboiled tap water as the bulk of the liquor I assume I won't need to specifically aerate? I'll be having to pour the water from a pan into the FV anyway, so it'll probably get a bit more air in it then (should I sterilise the pan, or will the Campden tablet sort that out anyway?)

The yeast will always benefit from giving the wort a good aeration, just give it a good thrashing stir with a plastic or metal (sterilised) paddle or big spoon. The idea is to give the yeast oxygen to allow it to reproduce before it settles down and gets on with the anaerobic process of turning the sugars into alcohol.

- Dissolving the kit ingredients: is there any harm in boiling this for a bit to ensure sterility, or is it better just to get it dissolved into some pre-boiled, hot water?

The kit ingrediants shouldn't need boiling. Just dissolve it in boiled water.

- The kit instructions use added sugar, I was intending to use some spraymalt instead of household sugar as I reckon this'll be more flavoursome

:thumb:

- I'm considering making a yeast starter culture to ensure a rapid onset of fermentation and to check the yeast is OK. I might as well use the yeast that comes in the kit (assuming there's some in there, I haven't opened the tin yet!). It might be of interest to use a different one, the CAMRA book notes that Safale-O4 is a fool-proof beginners' yeast but a bit lacking in character. They also mention Danstar Windsor. I might be tempted to try recovering some from a bottle, since I'll be making a starter anyway, but maybe that's not a great idea to start with!

Most kit yeast is fairly useless, if you can get S-O4 give that a go. It's a pretty common yeast.

- I think I will get a hydrometer, I'm a scientist by trade and will enjoy seeing the progress of the fermentation and getting an idea of the ABV!

Most of us consider a hydrometer to be an essential bit of kit.

 

[drf]

Cheers to ano & jamesb (& for pointing me in this direction!)

You should sanitise the pan as Campden isn't a very effective steriliser (it's particularly useless against gram negative bacteria such as acetobacter which turns alcohol into vinegar). It wouldn't hurt to give the wort a whip up with a long spoon, but you're right it will probably be alright.

Righty-ho. Maybe I'll get a paddle as well then.

S-04 is excellent in my opinion althogh my last batch was a little slow to get going. Rehydrating or making a starter will decrease this 'lag' time as you correctly say.

I'll be getting some in as well then!

Finally some may pick you up on your use of the word 'sterilise'. In the home it's difficult to get a completely sterile surface (without burning it or an autoclave), you can only do your best by sanitising the equipment, that is reducing the microbial organisms to such a level as to be insignificant. Sterility would be complete removal, which is unecessary anyway.

I'll bear that in mind!

Oh, another question regarding sorting the temperature of the wort. The kit has a suggested amount of hot/cold water, though I can't remember what the ratio was at the moment. Any tips on a good ratio to get the wort to a bit above pitching temperature without having to fiddle around with trying to add any more hot/cold water. Obviously this'll be dependent on the cold water temperature, but a rough idea would be useful (if I have reasonable success with the first batch and continue to more brews I'll probably invest in a heating belt for the winter - there's only one place in the house the FV is going to be able to go, which unfortunately is near the window in the kitchen. This isn't going to be ideal from a constant temperature point of view, but I'm hoping that a bit of insulation with bubble wrap and keeping an eye on a thermometer either in the brew every now and then, or wedged between the insulation and the FV will at least give me an idea of what's going on).

 

[corby_brewer]

hiya and welcome to the best forum in the land.

If its a 40 pint kit then is usually calls for 6 pints of boiling water and the make it up with cold water, then leave it till the temperature is between 18 and 20 degrees, but ive found that when you add the cold water the temperature usually comes out at about 18 egrees any way. as for the insullation on my last kit i used bubble wrap and just kept an eye on the temperature.

DS

 

[jamesb]

Cheers to ano & jamesb (& for pointing me in this direction!)

You should sanitise the pan as Campden isn't a very effective steriliser (it's particularly useless against gram negative bacteria such as acetobacter which turns alcohol into vinegar). It wouldn't hurt to give the wort a whip up with a long spoon, but you're right it will probably be alright.

Righty-ho. Maybe I'll get a paddle as well then.

Don't use the VWP to sanitise the pan if it's aluminium, it will react badly. Have no idea what to use instead though :hmm: :wha:

 

[drf]

Don't use the VWP to sanitise the pan if it's aluminium, it will react badly. Have no idea what to use instead though :hmm: :wha:

Stainless stell would be alright though, yes? Probably as long as it isn't left in there too long. Mind you, if I boil some water in it for washing out the FV/dissolving the kit ingredients or any other purpose, it'll be sanitized enough no doubt.

 

[jamesb]

Don't use the VWP to sanitise the pan if it's aluminium, it will react badly. Have no idea what to use instead though :hmm: :wha:

Stainless stell would be alright though, yes? Probably as long as it isn't left in there too long. Mind you, if I boil some water in it for washing out the FV/dissolving the kit ingredients or any other purpose, it'll be sanitized enough no doubt.

SS should be fine. There is a school of thought that says you shouldn't use chlorinated products on SS (VWP is a chlorinated caustic) but I've never had a problem - it can cause pitting of the SS. Just limit contact time to about 20 minutes.

 

[drf]

I'm rather looking forward to trying all of this out - I'll post progress when I get things going.

Another question re: casking. Should I prime the cask or not? The CAMRA book I have is of the opinion that a well-brewed beer, left to condition long enough shouldn't need either priming or fining. I'm willing to give the beer a decent length condition (elsewhere I've seen comments suggesting that the Youngs Harvest Yorkshire Bitter that I have really benefits from an 8 week condition. I mightn't be able to wait that long, but I'll definately give it at least 4, maybe more.

 

[jamesb]

You really want to get a layer of CO2 over the beer as soon as possible to protect it from the air, so I'd always suggest priming - unless you're force carbonating but you don't need to worry about that at the moment.

*cough*Cornies*cough*