MyQul
Chairman of the Bored
Well, it's made a cracking brown ale
Shepheard Neame 1698 Yeast
- Thread starter terrym
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Well, it's made a cracking brown ale
marlon
Senior Member
TBH, 'wait for more courage' might have been more honest of me. Never tried it before and I've got 4 Woodfordes kits waiting for my attention. My current thinking is to sling the yeast packets and have a go with the 1698. How long d'you recon it would take to grow enough?
MyQul
Chairman of the Bored
About 3 weeks. It's not hard just a bit time consuming. I'd definatly recommend adding the yeast to a wherry. When people ask "how do I improve/pimp/tweak a kit. The usual response is dry hop it or may be add some grain steeping. But yeast is the most important ingrediantand I'd say try a liquid yeast even before something as simple as dry hopping. I think a lot of kit/newer brewer are put off by using liquid yeast as making starters/yeast culturing appear quite hard (even though it's not)
I think the SN strain will go great with a wherry seeing as wherry is an English beer and SN is an English strain
marlon
Senior Member
Many thanks MyQul, I will definitely have a go at the 1698 culturing as my next Wherry tweak, without adjusting hops & grains. I've got a 'usually tweaked' wherry conditioning at the mo so I'll be able to compare the two, - if it hasn't 'evaporated' by the time the second one's ready!
Just to recycle some of the things I found with this yeast and mentioned way back in this thread, having completed three brews with it.
It took about three weeks to get a good quantity of yeast to pitch as MyQuls method, in some ways that was the easy bit
For each of the three brews I did (a boosted Burton Bridge bitter kit, a Landlords Bitter kit out the box, and an extract brew of my making) I ended up having to micromanage the primary fermentation. The yeast is seriously top fermenting and if left to its own devices will build a massive krausen of creamy yeast which even for the 16 litre extract brew I did in my Youngs FV will hit the lid and more. I gave up on blow off tubes and just let it ooze out of the FV from under the lid . I also found it necessary to open up the FV and break down the krausen sometimes twice a day at its peak and turn it back into the brew. The first brew I did nearly stalled because most of the yeast ended up in the krausen and not in the brew, and it wasn't until I turned in the krausen that it started up again. So if you don't like opening up your FV be warned.
I also think it takes longer to ferment out which may explain MyQuls experience.
It also seems to produce a lot of yeast compared to other yeasts I have used.
Finally I was initially impressed with the fruity taste that it seemed to bring to the Burton Bridge kit, but this has now gone, so that may be the kit itself after all. And the Landlords kit and my extract brew haven't shown up the same fruitiness.
So if you are prepared for the possibility of nursing your 1698 brews its probably worth a go to find out. But don't go on holiday when you do it!
Finally I won't bother with it again, too much faff for me. But I may try another bottle conditioned yeast later.
It took about three weeks to get a good quantity of yeast to pitch as MyQuls method, in some ways that was the easy bit
For each of the three brews I did (a boosted Burton Bridge bitter kit, a Landlords Bitter kit out the box, and an extract brew of my making) I ended up having to micromanage the primary fermentation. The yeast is seriously top fermenting and if left to its own devices will build a massive krausen of creamy yeast which even for the 16 litre extract brew I did in my Youngs FV will hit the lid and more. I gave up on blow off tubes and just let it ooze out of the FV from under the lid . I also found it necessary to open up the FV and break down the krausen sometimes twice a day at its peak and turn it back into the brew. The first brew I did nearly stalled because most of the yeast ended up in the krausen and not in the brew, and it wasn't until I turned in the krausen that it started up again. So if you don't like opening up your FV be warned.
I also think it takes longer to ferment out which may explain MyQuls experience.
It also seems to produce a lot of yeast compared to other yeasts I have used.
Finally I was initially impressed with the fruity taste that it seemed to bring to the Burton Bridge kit, but this has now gone, so that may be the kit itself after all. And the Landlords kit and my extract brew haven't shown up the same fruitiness.
So if you are prepared for the possibility of nursing your 1698 brews its probably worth a go to find out. But don't go on holiday when you do it!
Finally I won't bother with it again, too much faff for me. But I may try another bottle conditioned yeast later.
cheapbrew
Junk and disorderly
Terry just a thought, Did you use the same amount for each brew? could it have been overpitched?
You might be right about the overpitching. I didn't measure out the yeast for the second and third brews, just guesstimated it, although I only used part of the yeast I recovered from the previous brews. Nonetheless it still managed a 6" krausen on the 16 litre extract brew, which tried to 'escape' from the FV. And there still remains the need to turn in the yeast, the idea of which came from a link My Qul posted and compared well with my experience.http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=564661&postcount=31
And just a note on attenuation. Subject to hydrometer reading inaccuracies I got about 71%, 74%, and a massive 81% in that order...... :hmm:
So read through this a bit more, I will start the culture possibly tonight or tomorrow.
150-200ml water with about 5-10grams of dme (expect reduction in the liquid)
From what I am reading you all seem to agree to gyrate the fermenter regular.
What temps did you guys ferment at? I dont use a fridge but I think ill manage 20 and then be able to put it in a warmer place 22
150-200ml water with about 5-10grams of dme (expect reduction in the liquid)
From what I am reading you all seem to agree to gyrate the fermenter regular.
What temps did you guys ferment at? I dont use a fridge but I think ill manage 20 and then be able to put it in a warmer place 22
MyQul
Chairman of the Bored
My experience with the strain was a little different from terry's. I've only used it once so far. Like terry there was definately fruity esters in the starter when I tasted it but not really in the beer. Although that may be because I used it in a brown ale with 4 types of crystal and any delicate fruit flavours got lost
It produced about a 3" krausen on a 23L brew. Just to make sure the yeast was in the wort and not floating above it in he krausen I swirled and sloshed it back in rather than opening the FV and strirring it. I think it only had this smallish krausen as I clean my FV's with washing up liquid. Washing up liquid destoys the head on beer (I'm not that bothered about head on my beer else I wouldn't use WUL), and I strongly suspect the surficants in WUL also retard the krausen. As I also use Wyeast 1469 which is also supposed to have a huge krausen but I've never had more than about 3" on my brews with that strain either. However, I don't use WUL to clean my starter demijon and the krausens on that are usually huge for both strains, completely filling the head space in the DJ.
I got 78% attenuation with it. I also found it fairly flocctuant and clears well. I found it to give a quite a malty beer which I really enjoyed and will be using it again
It produced about a 3" krausen on a 23L brew. Just to make sure the yeast was in the wort and not floating above it in he krausen I swirled and sloshed it back in rather than opening the FV and strirring it. I think it only had this smallish krausen as I clean my FV's with washing up liquid. Washing up liquid destoys the head on beer (I'm not that bothered about head on my beer else I wouldn't use WUL), and I strongly suspect the surficants in WUL also retard the krausen. As I also use Wyeast 1469 which is also supposed to have a huge krausen but I've never had more than about 3" on my brews with that strain either. However, I don't use WUL to clean my starter demijon and the krausens on that are usually huge for both strains, completely filling the head space in the DJ.
I got 78% attenuation with it. I also found it fairly flocctuant and clears well. I found it to give a quite a malty beer which I really enjoyed and will be using it again
MyQul
Chairman of the Bored
Just room temp. I simply left mine on the kitchen work top whilst it was fermenting. I've put yeast cultures in the airing cupboard before where it's quite warm. I started mine off with 100ml water with 5g of DME for 1.020 first step up
Sorry I mixed things up there, starters yes I leave at room temp.. I meant your main batch? I was going to put in my cooler WC which will be 20 this time of year then raise it to room temp. might do was you suggest and over grow and decant into a jar..
Mind you by the sounds of it you could crop your heart out with this one.
MyQul
Chairman of the Bored
I fermented at 20C for about 5 days then let it rise to ambient temp for the rest of fermentation. Yes, you can definately top crop as much as you like. But overbuilding will do the job well
And all my brews go into a water bath set for about 19*C.
marlon
Senior Member
Gents, I've tried to take on board all the points raised above. My first problem will be making sure I'm around regularly to slosh the FV about. SWMBO's got several trips planned for us this summer, starting with Wednesday this week. So, I need to make sure I'm around for 3 - 4 weeks at a time before I make a start. Might have to wait until October...or...I COULD tell SWMBO to go by herself....s*"t...who am I kidding..?
marlon
Senior Member
Tried a pint of the Shep's 1698 bottle conditioned on Saturday. Poured it carefully, saved the dregs and began culturing up. Poured into 1 litre PET bottle and added 5g DME & 100ml boiled & cooled water. Been shaking the bottle 3 - 4 times daily since. Haven't noticed much activity yet. Should I add another measure of DME & water yet or wait a bit longer?
MyQul
Chairman of the Bored
I've always found the first 1 or two step up's is almost like your doing it on faith as I never seem to see anything at least for the first step up because the amount of yeast is so small.
Follow MyQuls method. It works.
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53567
My experience is that it is slow to start; you will hardly notice the difference in yeast quantity in the first few days. It does take about three weeks to generate enough yeast to make up a normal brew, as MyQul says.
Remember, 'Patience is the friend of the Homebrewer'
And be prepared for the possibility of a lot of intervention during the primary when brewing with this yeast...read the earlier parts of this thread.
marlon
Senior Member
Thanks Myqul & Terrym, I've added another 5g solution of DME and shaken the b@//@cks out of it. It's very throthy then but dies down to nothing after a few minutes. But you've restored my faith somewhat, I'll keep going with it. Thanks lads..:thumb:
marlon
Senior Member
Stepped up the first 250ml just now. Still can't see much, but I've got faith
If you can see a layer of yeast, however thin, on the bottom of your jar, then you are on your way, since you will have started with hardly anything visible! So as you say, keep faith :thumb:
