How to avoid NEIPA oxidation?

[Braumeister]

I’m planning to brew my first NEIPA tomorrow, from the recipe in the Greg Hughes book.

I’d be interested to hear from anyone who has brewed one, and how they avoided oxidation, or had oxidation issues.

I’m not able to do a fully closed transfer as I don’t have a pressure fermenter. I do however do a ‘faux’ closed transfer from an SS brewtech 5 gallon brew bucket using gravity and 1-2 psi in a purged keg. I’m hoping that will be enough. I could ferment in a corny keg and transfer to another but I don’t really want to use up 1 of 2 kegs for fermenting in.

Would be good to hear from anyone who has had experience kegging a heavily hopped beer without a pressure related FV.

Thanks!

Recipe:

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

The oats as well as the hops are a concern for causing oxidisation quicker.

I would say don't do it unless you have a proper closed transfer system.

Use your kegs if you have to.

 

[Agentgonzo]

I add ascorbic acid before bottling. It doesn't prevent it, but does reduce oxidation

 

[Hazelwood Brewery]

Probably best to not go full NEIPA if you can’t exclude oxygen.

 

[Leon103]

Just the use the cornies which give you the opportunity to do pressure fermenting and closed transfer

 

[Sadfield]

I'd agree with what @Leon103 says. With one massive caveat. Only if you've a reliable way of separating the fermented beer from the dry hops, your going to be using, when you transfer to another keg.

 

[Braumeister]

Interesting, thanks! I guess I’ll postpone this one till if I get a fermzilla or something like that. Next brew planned is a west coast IPA so I’ll save the hops and just skip straight to that instead.

 

[NedDefiance]

Sodium metabisulfite has always worked a treat for me with my NEIPA(s). I do my best to eliminate cold side oxidation but I cannot do pressure transfers either. Never had an issue with oxidation since adding SMB to my routine. It goes into every beer I make now.

EXBEERIMENT | COLD-SIDE OXIDATION: IMPACT OF DOSING NEW ENGLAND IPA WITH SODIUM METABISULFITE (SMB) AT PACKAGING

 

[The Baron]

I add ascorbic acid before bottling. It doesn't prevent it, but does reduce oxidation

A big second on that

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

I put AA in every beer, but I put it in the mash.

Genus brewing said it was a good idea so I did it lol. Love those guys.

 

[Benfleet Brewery]

I don’t close transfer, but I do take care, and have never had any trouble with oxidation on my NEIPAs. That said, I’ve not used as many hops or oats as you have in your recipe so I suppose they may not really be NEIPAs!
My usual kegging process is to fully clean and sanitise the keg and other equipment. The lid is put on the keg and it’s filled with CO2 to 20 psi and left to the side to stand for a few minutes. When everything is ready to go I purge the keg, open it (you can’t see right to the bottom as it’s got CO2 in the bottom of it), add half a campden tablet then carefully syphon the beer from the FV into the keg. When done the keg is filled to 60 psi with CO2 and purged 8 times, then carbonated ready to serve.
I have an NEIPA on tap at the moment that was kegged 7 weeks ago. The hop aroma and flavour has fallen somewhat but there are no signs of oxidation.
This was the recipe I used:

HOME BREW RECIPE:

Title: Benfleet NEIPA

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: Specialty IPA: New England IPA
Boil Time: 45 min
Batch Size: 23 liters (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 27.65 liters
Boil Gravity: 1.045
Efficiency: 75% (brew house)

STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.051
Final Gravity: 1.011
ABV (standard): 5.28%
IBU (tinseth): 15.07
SRM (morey): 3.33
Mash pH: 5.54

FERMENTABLES:
4 kg - Extra Pale Ale Malt (80%)
0.5 kg - Torrified Wheat (10%)
0.5 kg - Flaked Oats (10%)

HOPS:
30 g - Citra, Type: Pellet, AA: 12, Use: Boil for 10 min, IBU: 15.07
25 g - Citra, Type: Pellet, AA: 12, Use: Dry Hop (High Krausen) for 9 min
25 g - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop (High Krausen) for 9 min
25 g - Amarillo, Type: Pellet, AA: 8.6, Use: Dry Hop (High Krausen) for 9 min
25 g - Simcoe, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.7, Use: Dry Hop (High Krausen) for 9 min
25 g - Cashmere, Type: Pellet, AA: 8.5, Use: Dry Hop (High Krausen) for 9 min

MASH GUIDELINES:
1) Strike, Temp: 68 C, Time: 75 min, Amount: 20.7 L
2) Sparge, Temp: 76 C, Time: 15 min, Amount: 10.95 L
Starting Mash Thickness: 2.8 L/kg

OTHER INGREDIENTS:
0.25 each - Campden Tablets, Time: 0 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Mash
0.25 each - Campden Tablets, Time: 0 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Sparge
4 ml - Lactic acid, Time: 0 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Mash
2 ml - Lactic acid, Time: 0 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Sparge
8 g - Calcium Chloride (dihydrate), Time: 0 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Mash
6 g - Calcium Chloride (dihydrate), Time: 0 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Sparge
0.5 tsp - Yeast Nutrient, Time: 5 min, Type: Other, Use: Boil
0.5 tsp - Irish Moss, Time: 10 min, Type: Fining, Use: Mash

YEAST:
Crossmyloof - Clipper
Starter: No
Form: Dry
Attenuation (avg): 80%
Flocculation: High
Optimum Temp: 17.78 - 22.78 C
Fermentation Temp 20 C

TARGET WATER PROFILE:
Profile Name: NEIPA
Ca2: 120
Mg2: 10
Na: 26
Cl: 250
SO4: 50
HCO3: 20

 

[Buffers brewery]

I’ve brewed this recipe three times now, once gaining a third place in one of our competitions. I don’t have a pressure fermenter and don’t do pressure transfer. I have a standard plastic fermentation bucket with a lid but modified to have a bottom tap and a push-fit connector that allows me to collect fermentation gas in mylar balloons (3-off) that I use to fill my pressure barrel with gas prior to transfer. My brew fridge is a couple of feet off the ground so do a closed gravity transfer, returning the gas from the barrel back to the fermenter. I do have a (not so) secret weapon in my dry hop hopper that

allows me to load up the dry hops when the yeast is added to the wort and the lid is fitted. After 5 days of fermentation I can release the hops without removing the lid. On average it takes me around six to eight weeks to empty a 40 pint barrel and I’ve not experienced any oxidation in 3 brews so far

 

[DocAnna]

I put AA in every beer, but I put it in the mash.

Genus brewing said it was a good idea so I did it lol. Love those guys.

Ascorbic acid v quickly degrades and disappears with heat - it won't survive boiling, sorry. It starts to break down at 50° and once you are over 80°C anything left will disappear in minutes. It's why cooked veg other than steamed/microwaved lose all their Vit C.

@Braumeister If I may suggest, if you really want to do an NEIPA without closed transfer:
Only do a one stage dry hop after fermentation is complete.Mix a teaspoon of Vit C (Ascorbic acid) through the dry hops, and add the combined mix at no more than 18°C and chill to near zero over the course of no more than 3 days. This will give time for hop extraction but the cooler temperature slows oxidation. This will only work if during this time your airlock is connected to a CO2 reserve/balloon/pressure to avoid draw back of air as it chills. Then transfer to a purged keg.

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

Might be worth adding later in the process then Anna?

I wonder why Genus brewing say to do that?

 

[DocAnna]

Might be worth adding later in the process then Anna?

I wonder why Genus brewing say to do that?

Yes anytime later will work, though there's a risk it will all be consumed without benefit if added too early. Adding at the time of transfer to the fermenter also wouldn't be a good idea as the yeast needs the dissolved oxygen at the beginning of fermentation, hence why commercial breweries intentionally oxygenate the wort.

As to Genus brewing... umm... likely well intentioned?

 

[Agentgonzo]

I wonder why Genus brewing say to do that?

I remember watching the video a year or so ago. He rambled on for a bit and I couldn't understand why he added it to the mash

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

I'm a gullible tw@t

 

[Tess Tickle's Brewery]

Yes anytime later will work, though there's a risk it will all be consumed without benefit if added too early. Adding at the time of transfer to the fermenter also wouldn't be a good idea as the yeast needs the dissolved oxygen at the beginning of fermentation, hence why commercial breweries intentionally oxygenate the wort.

As to Genus brewing... umm... likely well intentioned?

I shall take that advice on board - thanks Anna.

 

[The Baron]

I'm a gullible tw@t

I think we are all gullible Tess. I bet we all do things not just in brewing that somebody has told us and probably still do it years after until somebody tells us that it does not work and the reason why

 

[Sadfield]

Might be worth adding later in the process then Anna?

I wonder why Genus brewing say to do that?

Probably to mitigate hot side aeration.

https://beerandbrewing.com/dictionary/4vQFCvGmuD/