I've noticed a massive increase in the amount of beers being labelled as hazy ipas, and it's got me thinking after reading another thread about NEIPAs what the point is? I've brewed hazy beers but it's more to do with laziness and lack of skill than want. Is hazy a chance for breweries to be lazy and knock out beers quicker, or is there a discernable impact of hazy on taste that I am yet to find?
What does 'Hazy' bring to the table
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An Ankoù
Landlord.
Hazy beer is beer in which you want to taste the yeast. A hefeweizen or a belgian wit, for example. I've seen posts about NEIPA and from what I've read, I really don't want to drink one. Getting a nice clear bitter or lager is part of the art and the aesthetics. Not convinced by "unfiltered" as a selling point, but if my lager has a bit of a haze it doesn't taste any worse for it, just encourages me to try harder next time. In short, it's a cop out for poor brewing / packaging. In my opinion.
Hazy in NEIPAs isn't about wanting to taste the yeast. That's the last thing you want. It's an interaction between the yeast and the huge amounts of hop chlorophenols that remain in solution that contribute to the haze. The haze should only ever be a byproduct of the huge amounts of cold-side hops. If your goal is haze, then the beer will likely end up ****. Paradoxically it's highly flocculant English yeasts such as 1318 that seem to end up producing the hazier finishes in this style.
I too enjoy a nice clear beer, and I'm not convinced that unfiltered beers are necessarily more flavoursome. That being said, people were claiming that NEIPAs were a fad 4/5 years ago, and yet there are still getting more and more popular.
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British drinkers are wary of hazy beers because traditionally it meant a cask was either nearly finished or someone had kicked it in the cellar, disturbing the yeast. But haze in NEIPA-like beers *is nothing to do with yeast*. It seems to be an interaction between hop polyphenols (from high levels of dry-hopping, particularly of antipodean hops like Galaxy) and protein from grist additions like oats (added to get a fuller mouthfeel). But originally that interaction was just a side-effect of trying to get lots of hoppiness with a full mouthfeel. Now some people aim for haze as an aim in itself, which is just nuts.
But it has become a bit of an indicator of heavy dry-hopping and high-protein grists, even in 4% cask beers.
But it's nothing to do with yeast or bad guts.
[Edit - DD2 got there before me - but they are polyphenols and not chlorophenol ;-) ]
An Ankoù
Landlord.
OK. You've convinced me. I'll have to add NEIPA to the bucket list. Not sure why polyphenol / protein haze would create an attractive flavour, so I guess there's only one way to find out.
Every time I see a thread on NEIPA, I see people stressing about oxydation. Is it more of an issue with these
beers than others?
Every time I see a thread on NEIPA, I see people stressing about oxydation. Is it more of an issue with these
beers than others?
It's not necessarily that the haze is creating the desirable flavour, but rather that the huge amount of dry-hopping does. It just happens to also end up being very hazy as a by-product.
Apologies for introducing chlorophenols into the thread. NB was correct that I was meaning polyphenols.
NEIPAs are singularly delicate when it comes to oxidation. So much so that even commercial breweries really struggle with packaging and shelf-stability. If you keg, then you are good to go. It is an utter ballache and incredibly disheartening otherwise.
Interesting stuff. Lost me with the chemistry stuff though.
Would it be possible to replicate the dry hop schedule of some of the hazy or NEIPA beers and produce a clear beer? I'm sure I have had many clear, or at least clearer, 'new world' hop beers.
Would it be possible to replicate the dry hop schedule of some of the hazy or NEIPA beers and produce a clear beer? I'm sure I have had many clear, or at least clearer, 'new world' hop beers.
prog99
Landlord.
I'd suggest hunting one down to see if you like the style before you try.
prog99
Landlord.
Its about the mouthfeel too. They are a lot smoother than a similarly hopped ipa.
Edison
Regular.
Yeah, I think these things can be a bit faddy, West Coast IPA’s boasting 100+ IBU’s were everywhere a few years ago, these ultra turbid East Coast/New England IPA things seem to have taken their place in recent years (think I prefer the former).
They sometimes have no bittering hops at all and pour vast quantities of hops after flame-out into the whirlpool only (perhaps plus dry hops) and to get the most fruity hop flavour/aroma they are packaged extremely young, so not much time for the beer to drop clear.
If you ever get the chance to try it, Triple Hazy from Brewdog is worth a try, deceptively drinkable for a 9.5% beer!
https://beerandbrewing.com/unlock-the-secrets-of-new-england-style-ipas/
They sometimes have no bittering hops at all and pour vast quantities of hops after flame-out into the whirlpool only (perhaps plus dry hops) and to get the most fruity hop flavour/aroma they are packaged extremely young, so not much time for the beer to drop clear.
If you ever get the chance to try it, Triple Hazy from Brewdog is worth a try, deceptively drinkable for a 9.5% beer!
https://beerandbrewing.com/unlock-the-secrets-of-new-england-style-ipas/
Algernon
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A good supermarket version is the Cannonball from Magic Rock. The big sell-outs have sucked up to Tesco ( I jest - well done to them and thanks for putting decent beer into an accessible and affordable format) so it's everywhere now. If you want to go large, the unhuman and neohuman cannonball variants are excellent examples of the style, esp Neo.
It's a cracking beer, but I wouldn't really call it a NEIPA. BrewDog vs. Cloudwater and North Brewing Lost Cosmonauts are probably my favourite examples of the style, readily available in Tesco.
chillipickle
Landlord.
DD2 have you tried brewdog O-G hazy, really good by far my fav neipa/hazy.Shame it's 7.2% could live on the stuff if it wasnt so strong.Tesco £3 a can.
prog99
Landlord.
It’s the original strength hazy Jane. you can get a lower og one simply called hazy Jane.
Edison
Regular.
If you like these two, the triple is the best of the three, tastes smoother and more quaffable than the OG. Dangerous stuff!
chuffer
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Love a hazy beer (not for aesthetics) but only if it means it's a result of the adjuncts (adding to the mouthfeel and sweetness) and the use of lots of fruity hops. I'm not a fan of the hazy beers due to yeast.
Historically (to me) it seemed that most brewers were of the opinion that dry hopping added only aroma. But now, with these big fruity NEIPA beers that are heavy on the dry hop (some manufacturers even stating that they're double dry-hopped or triple dry-hopped) it must be the case that we can all agree that dry hopping adds to the flavour too?
Historically (to me) it seemed that most brewers were of the opinion that dry hopping added only aroma. But now, with these big fruity NEIPA beers that are heavy on the dry hop (some manufacturers even stating that they're double dry-hopped or triple dry-hopped) it must be the case that we can all agree that dry hopping adds to the flavour too?
Oh **** I think I've just realised what happened to my Neipa. It was utterly delicious on kegging day. I was dancing around like a fairy thinking I'd created THE PERFECT BEER! Now, not so much. No fruitiness left, it's just dull. I had an issue with my racking wand, it was pulliing air into the cane. Gutted!
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