Whats the next step up from kit brewing?

[Wabby]

I've been brewing for 2 months now. Still a young'un at this, I know :thumb:

I want to start progressing and making better / more improved beers rather than going from kit to kit etc. Where is best to start?

I dont mind throwing a few quid at it to start, as I didnt mind with the kit brewing tbh.

I have found a few kits that I like that I have got back on brewing at the moment, but can't help but think how much 'better' they could be, but not sure how to go about it.

Cheers for your help guys.

 

[Covrich]

For teh best results you will want to go all grain, now there are two routes I would say to go from where you are..

1) do a small AG batch which you can do now with virtually minimal additional equipment and you can get used to the processes ..

2) look at doing extract, it is a half way house between kit and full AG , basically you use plain extract and add hops and yeast according to your recipe.. some steep specialty grains too to add flavour..

Doing AG takes a lot more time and a brew day for a large batch will take around 5 hours typically give or take, so just be prepared for that..


Another option is to make look at pimping up kits..

So the question is what takes your fancy? do you ultimatley want to get involved and make your beer fresh with fresh grain and hops and yeast.. Or just pimp up where you are?

 

[chuffer]

Buy extract and choose your own hops....search online for john palmer's brewing your first beer, its an article/sampler section from his book that was published online. Step by step instructions on brewing your first extract brew

 

[cornyandy]

Alcoholics Anonymous ........

 

[Wabby]

Are the small AG batches like SMaSH and the like? Looks pretty simple to me and I have a massive stainless pot already :)

Where can I buy malt extract from and get recipies to play around that and hops etc whilst I delve deeper into the AG batches scenario? :)

I assume I can use a 30l FV even for a 10 litre batch? Or will the headspace be too much?

I also assume (from my quick google) that *most* extract kits won't need any extra fermentables, as what I saw had a SG of 1.046 ...?

 

[chub1]

Hi
I started with one can kits, went on to adding hops, progressed to adding steeped grains and now doing small batch extract brews and will eventually have a go at AG as everyone recommends it. At present i am having fun with my extract experiments(using the recipe builder on here) and although having only a couple complete(still waiting on some carbing and some fermenting) the results are way better than any kit and will continue to experiment for a while.:thumb:

 

[Dads_Ale]

Hi Wabby.

I am in the process in writing a sort of guidance sheet on AG brewing in your kitchen. Essentially its a run through on a brew day using converted FVs.
It is still work in progress but if you are interested just pm me an email address and I will send you a copy. Will give you an idea of what is involved.

Cheers

 

[Cwrw666]

Don't want to tread on anyone's toes but extract brews that I have done don't taste any better than a decent 2 can kit.
So I'd advise just switching to all grain. By all means try some oven top small batches, but I went straight from many, many years of kit brewing to full 23L AG brews and my only regret is that I didn't think to go bigger, as it takes more or less the same time commitment no matter the size of the brew. (5 hours approximately but there are some forumites here who split that over 2 days)
All you need for a 23L BIAB AG brew on top of the equipment you already have for kit brewing is a boiler and a BIAB bag - round about £100. AG brewing is cheaper than kit brewing anyway, so it doesn't take long to recoup the investment. (less than a year in my case but maybe you're less of a p***-head than me).:lol:

 

[Tony1951]

Don't want to tread on anyone's toes but extract brews that I have done don't taste any better than a decent 2 can kit.
So I'd advise just switching to all grain. By all means try some oven top small batches, but I went straight from many, many years of kit brewing to full 23L AG brews and my only regret is that I didn't think to go bigger, as it takes more or less the same time commitment no matter the size of the brew. (5 hours approximately but there are some forumites here who split that over 2 days)
All you need for a 23L BIAB AG brew on top of the equipment you already have for kit brewing is a boiler and a BIAB bag - round about £100. AG brewing is cheaper than kit brewing anyway, so it doesn't take long to recoup the investment. (less than a year in my case but maybe you're less of a p***-head than me).:lol:

+1.

There is no point at all in my humble opinion, in going from kit brewing to buying dme and doing extract brews. I would go right into All Grain right away. If you are unsure do a couple of stove top brews. If not, buy a boiler and get going big style. I don't regret doing a few 10 litre stove top brews, I got confidence without risking anything much and realised that I could make vastly better beer than the kit brews I had made.

DO USE A GOOD RECIPE....I wasted some time and materials inventing my own recipes with very little knowledge. That was daft. There are great recipes that are simple and will guarantee a lovely ale.

This one is a favourite of mine:

23 litres finished volume.

6kg Pale Malt
150 grms Crystal Malt
Mash in 15 litres of water for one hour at 68c
Drain into FV to store temporarily
Sparge with additional 15 litres of water at 75C

Boil wort for one hour

Hops:
22gm Magnum for 60 minutes
37 gm EKG for 10 minutes
37gm EKG at flame out.

Cool as rapidly as possible to 20C

Pitch Nottingham yeast (Gervin Ale Yeast - wilkos for about £1.20

This should come in as a lovely IPA between 5.8% and 7.8% depending on your efficiency.

If your pot won't accommodate the volumes just scale it back. These amounts assume a 23 litre finished brew.

By the way - if you buy bulk materials like 25kg grain from suppliers like Geterbrewed, that whole recipe would cost about £11 - - Six pounds fifty for the grain, one pound twenty for the yeast and about three quid for the hops. You just can't loose to get five gallons of high strength wonderful beer for that.

 

[Covrich]

Are the small AG batches like SMaSH and the like? Looks pretty simple to me and I have a massive stainless pot already :)

Where can I buy malt extract from and get recipies to play around that and hops etc whilst I delve deeper into the AG batches scenario? :)

I assume I can use a 30l FV even for a 10 litre batch? Or will the headspace be too much?

I also assume (from my quick google) that *most* extract kits won't need any extra fermentables, as what I saw had a SG of 1.046 ...?

In that case it sounds like you are willing to make the big step up.. I would just go for it..

Smash brews are a good way to start and by doing smaller batches the risk is less and you will learn an incredible amount.. from there you can decide where to go next..

AG your brewing world opens up and you can make exactly what you want and you can pretty much get and use any ingredients and recipes at your disposal..

 

[sven945]

I've done a kit brew and I've got on with a stove top AG brew while waiting for the kit to clear in the bottles! (Though I did open one last night).

My local brew shop (Brewstore.co.uk) do all grain kits, so they supply you with the grains, hops and yeast for a brew. That means you don't have to worry about sourcing precisely the right grains or yeast for a recipe quite yet. The downside is that they don't tell you what the grains or hops are (for understandable reasons. They'll probably add an extra few quid on for the convenience), so options for modifying their recipe are limited.

 

[cornyandy]

Pardon the Jocularity on my previous post I couldn't resist, I would discount extract brewing simply on price, it can be more expensive than kits for a very similar product. My advice would be to come over to the dark side, the water is lovely over here.

 

[Wabby]

AG it is then.

What sized pot would I need to do 20l (ish) batches with BIAB method??

 

[wfr42]

http://www.thehomebrewcompany.co.uk/biab-starter-kit-peco-boiler-chiller-mashing-bag-mash-kit-p-2507.html

Is what a lot of us use, along with this
http://www.thehomebrewcompany.co.uk/hop-strainer-p-83.html

I used a 15litre plan for 10 litre batches. So guessing you would need about a 30litre pan.

 

[Covrich]

AG it is then.

What sized pot would I need to do 20l (ish) batches with BIAB method??

Full BIAB you will need a 50L pot.. however you can use other methods where you do a mash and a seperate sparge bbut will still want ideally 30l pot size minimum..

How do you want to heat it, gas burner or eleccy?

 

[Wabby]

I got a gas burner I could use in garage. Think my stove would be capable but garage sounds 'safer' from her indoors.

 

[Tony1951]

I got a gas burner I could use in garage. Think my stove would be capable but garage sounds 'safer' from her indoors.

I'm sure you know this, but just in case any youngsters are reading, ensure plenty of ventilation when burning large gas burners partially indoors. Lest someone some day be found dead from carbon monoxide. Hope this doesn't come over as patronising, but it happens with depressing regularity, even with small camping stoves in tents.

 

[Wabby]

Picking up a 30l cooler tonight to make a mash tun. Going all in. Lol

What size pan is best for boiling water? And where can I get one for boiling wort? Use the same one??

Also, best methd to chill without a chiller??

 

[cornyandy]

I don't use a chiller, (I know, shock horror) I sterilise the fermenter and lid very well then run almost boiling wort into it, leave it overnight and pitch the yeast in the morning. I've been doing it on and off for 20 years or so like this and have never had an issue that can be traced back to it. Chillers were only just coming onto the market 20 years ago and they were quite and expensive luxury that I couldn't quite afford.

 

[Wabby]

Bullet bitten.

60l fermenter on way to be my boiler / kettle.

First mash next weekend me thinks :)