WLP565 Saison fermentation temps - reassurance needed!

[bunkerbrewer]

I'm planning my first Saison for this weekend's brew, using the recipe from "Brewing Classic Styles" and White Labs WLP565.

The recommended fermentation profile is to start at 20°C, and gradually raise this to 27°C. 27°C ...!. That's a big number for someone who's more used to keeping things at or below the 20°C mark!

I understand this is to force the yeast to develop the characteristic saison flavours, but can someone reassure me the brew is going to be OK at that temperature?

 

[anthonyUK]

If it says that in Brewing classic styles I'd be happy to accept that as gospel.
I've listened to all the podcasts and John and Jamil are well respected in the field.
27°c is at the upper end for that yeast so all appears OK.

 

[bunkerbrewer]

If it says that in Brewing classic styles I'd be happy to accept that as gospel.
I've listened to all the podcasts and John and Jamil are well respected in the field.
27°c is at the upper end for that yeast so all appears OK.

You're right, I should trust the source :)

 

[zgoda]

It depends on yeast strain, but generally after initial 2-3 days you need to ramp temperature to get expected attenuation. With Wyeast French Saison it's not needed to ramp that high, but the original Belgian strain requires much higher temperature to finish fermentation.

 

[Farmbrew]

Yep...26 or 27C is what you ideally should use for Saison yeast.

F

 

[bunkerbrewer]

Thanks chaps. I was planning to leave it longer before gradually raising temps, but I'll do it after 2-3 days as suggested.

Does one degree C per day sound about right?

 

[Farmbrew]

You could prob get away with 1deg every 12hrs.

F

 

[Eli_D]

Yup.
I just bottled my saison after fermenting at 25. Worked a treat.

 

[Darcey]

I have brewed at 7.4% Black Saison, I dont know the yeast strain as it was cultured from another brewery. Transfered the wort at 27 and kept it at 27-29c for the first few days. It still didnt attenuate properly and we had to add the house yeast to finish it off. It depends how funky you want your beer to be really.

D

 

[zgoda]

I can recommend Wyeast French Saison yeast, less problems with attenuation, can be reused up to 2 times until start losing that nice character. And doesn't need any sugar to ferment down to 1.005!

 

[bunkerbrewer]

Thanks everyone. I'm pleased to say it seems to be working:

It's down to 1.005 after a week - I was all set to add a pack of champagne yeast but looks like that won't be needed. The OG was 1.048, so I make that 90% attenuation?! I did make a proper big starter, but on the other hand I was very tired when I brewed this one :)

It does feel very odd to open the brewfridge and have a wave of 27 degree warmth coming out though.

 

[Farmbrew]

Good job...enjoy the drinking part

F

 

[WelshPaul]

If it helps to allay your fears, the Westvleteren Trappist brewery ferments their beers at 28-29°C for primary.

 

[Harbey]

Reviving an old thread. I'm about to try a Saison too, using Belle Saison yeast from Lallemand. I've got no guidance on the pack or in my recipe for fermentation temps, so should I just do the same as above? Also, once you've hit the FG, do you leave it at that temp or bring it back down to something a little less tropical? I'm assuming that carbonation and conditioning is normal time and temps?

 

[Martybhoy]

I'm brewing James Morton's Saison soon. He recommends WLP565 and fermenting as high as 30-32°!!. He also states not to let the temperature drop once you start increasing it, as it risks the yeast stalling.

WLP565 is known to stop fermenting and restarting again as much as 2 weeks later. JM recommends adding dried champagne yeast at 75% attenuation to help it along. I'm personally going for WLP566, more fruity and less likely to stall.

 

[Zephyr259]

Drew Beecham from Experimental Brewing has done a lot of work on saison strains, he starts them cooler, around 16 - 17 c then lets them free rise after 3 days, but he's in california so we may have to apply some external heat, I'd probably go to 24c, think that's what I did with the Wyeast 3726 Farmhouse Ale strain (after starting at 19c) and it was pretty tasty. Some folks find they are fine pitching hot, others get issues with fusels.

 

[Harbey]

I brewed my saison today. It's now in the FV and I'm planning to gradually raise the temperature to about 24 after a few days. I'm just a bit unsure about carbonation. Can I do do this at regular temperatures or do I need to keep it high once I've raised the temperature?

 

[jeg3]

I've done 2 saisons first with wy3724 whoch steadily went down to 1.002 in 2 weeks at 20 degC (pre brew fridge), second with Mangrove Jack's saison went down to 1.004 much quicker, I started at 18 then ramped it up to 27 after a couple of days.

Both were excellent, but the second one was better tasting

 

[jeg3]

Reviving an old thread. I'm about to try a Saison too, using Belle Saison yeast from Lallemand. I've got no guidance on the pack or in my recipe for fermentation temps, so should I just do the same as above? Also, once you've hit the FG, do you leave it at that temp or bring it back down to something a little less tropical? I'm assuming that carbonation and conditioning is normal time and temps?

My second saison cooled as i was bottling it so I calculated 3 volumes at 20degC. I think it was about 175g sugar for a 20l batch

 

[WonderOnesBrewing]

I am fermenting a saison using WY3724 at 32c but I actually experienced the 1.030 stall. A week after the stall, its started up again. The Dupont yeast strain supposedly do better when there is no pressure in the fermentation vessel i.e. open fermentation. The higher temp certainly didn't help with the stall so may just put some sanitised tin foil over the fermenter opening next time and see how that goes.