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kelper

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I must have missed something - what's the problem with using washing up liquid?
These products often include Bitrex - a bittering agent to stop children drinking them and it can taint your equipment.

Household bleach is quite strong, so follow the dilution instructions. More is not better!
 

AnimatedGIF

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These products often include Bitrex - a bittering agent to stop children drinking them and it can taint your equipment.

Household bleach is quite strong, so follow the dilution instructions. More is not better!
Thanks @kelper. Does it taint even after rinsing? I just assumed washing up liquid was less offensive than bleach (even diluted) but without ever looking in to it.
 

kelper

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I don't know as I have not tried. Taste a tiny, tiny drop of Fairy liquid and see how long it takes to rinse away the test. Show the bottle to the ambulance crew.
 

Fireside Ales Homebrewery

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What's wrong with it I use it in the shower and rinse all the time no problem so far
@AnimatedGIF .Well technically you can use washing up liquid. Though washing up liquid, if not rinsed really, really, really well, can Leave behind a soap residue that will not only effect flavour, but will also ruin the head retention Of your beer. I think it is widely believed that there are better products to use to clean HB equipment. If you take two Of the same commercially bought beers that you know have good head retention and pour them into two glasses. One really well rinsed and clear of soap and one washed in soap with a little rinse. You will see that the head of the beer with potential soap residue will loose it’s head really quickly and the other will keep its head for a longer time. Up to you guys really. Either way, happy brewing 👍🍺
 

kelper

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Most people use much more detergent than necessary. If you use only a tiny amount it is unlikely to taint the plastic unless it's scratched. So don't use a pan scourer, just a nylon brush.
 

Cwrw666

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I just assumed washing up liquid was less offensive than bleach (even diluted) but without ever looking in to it.
Even the slightest trace of washing up liquid will totally destroy the head on your beer. Even your beer glass is better off just washed with plain water unless it gets really dirty. And then rinse it in loads of water before use.
 

An Ankoù

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I must have missed something - what's the problem with using washing up liquid?
It'll clean very well, but it's very hard to wash away the last traces and if there's any left, it'll make your beer go flat by reducing the surface tension of the poured beer.

Why is no rince sanitiser so popular, is it convenience?
No idea, mate. I wouldn't clean with anything that I can't rinse away after. But that's my choice. I suppose people think their water supply is infected so they shouldn't rinse.
 

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Household bleach is quite strong, so follow the dilution instructions. More is not better!
Yes! And it seems like a lot of people don't know that 'neat' bleach isn't as effective as diluted bleach. It's more effective as you lower the pH and it's why the bleach no-rinse thing works so well.

The no-rinse bleach sanitiser has to be made up new ever day. You can't store it, and that's fine because it's mad cheap.

In the podcast about it Charlie Talley based the measurements on US gallons and 5.25% bleach - cheap bleach here really varies and it can go from 0.99% up - it'll say what it is on the side of the bottle.

I've made an Excel and Google spreadsheet giving amounts in ml and ounces (Urghhh, dirty) and I've got it on Google docs - I'll link to it but ffs you've got to download your own copy and edit it. People keep asking for access to it - NO, you'll eff it all up. The yellow cells are ones you should change but realistically you should only change the bleach strength and maybe the custom amount of water. There's crap in that file I should remove, really, and cells I should make uneditable but that would make things too easy and I need the hate from people who can't use it. You can use citric acid instead of vinegar in the supporter's version**.


AND - if you buy thin bleach and it looks a little too yellowy and thicker than water put the cap on, shake it and have a look inside. If there are persistent bubbles like you'd get from washing up liquid DON'T use it for no-rinse sanitiser as it's still got surfactant in it that thick bleach has. It won't be no-rinse any more, it'll be a makes my beer taste like a vinyl record covered in plasters sanitiser.

** little nod to them in the know, there.
 
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kelper

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Good advice. Do not buy thick bleach by mistake, you want the cheapest bleach containing sodium hypochlorite and NOTHING else.
 

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Can you use the Chlorine flakes that are available for pool/hot tub treatment?
 

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@AnimatedGIF .Well technically you can use washing up liquid. Though washing up liquid, if not rinsed really, really, really well, can Leave behind a soap residue that will not only effect flavour, but will also ruin the head retention Of your beer. I think it is widely believed that there are better products to use to clean HB equipment. If you take two Of the same commercially bought beers that you know have good head retention and pour them into two glasses. One really well rinsed and clear of soap and one washed in soap with a little rinse. You will see that the head of the beer with potential soap residue will loose it’s head really quickly and the other will keep its head for a longer time. Up to you guys really. Either way, happy brewing 👍🍺
Even the slightest trace of washing up liquid will totally destroy the head on your beer. Even your beer glass is better off just washed with plain water unless it gets really dirty. And then rinse it in loads of water before use.
It'll clean very well, but it's very hard to wash away the last traces and if there's any left, it'll make your beer go flat by reducing the surface tension of the poured beer.
Thanks for increasing my knoweldge with informative responses athumb..

I don't know as I have not tried. Taste a tiny, tiny drop of Fairy liquid and see how long it takes to rinse away the test. Show the bottle to the ambulance crew.
@kelper I assumed that since you answered you either knew why or had experience.
 

kelper

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@kelper I assumed that since you answered you either knew why or had experience.
I don't use dishwasher liquid as I know it can taint equipment! I use chlorine on plastics and an oxi cleaner on metals.
 

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I use vwp, soak for 10 mins and it is clean then rinse. The issue with not doing it properly like this is you may start to think what else can I use washing up liquid on. Then you may find infection because it is not done properly. Your choice but i advise vwp,it will last for long time because you only need a teaspoon or so to clean say a corny keg or fermenter.
 

Justin Dean

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Yes! And it seems like a lot of people don't know that 'neat' bleach isn't as effective as diluted bleach. It's more effective as you lower the pH and it's why the bleach no-rinse thing works so well.

The no-rinse bleach sanitiser has to be made up new ever day. You can't store it, and that's fine because it's mad cheap.

In the podcast about it Charlie Talley based the measurements on US gallons and 5.25% bleach - cheap bleach here really varies and it can go from 0.99% up - it'll say what it is on the side of the bottle.

I've made an Excel and Google spreadsheet giving amounts in ml and ounces (Urghhh, dirty) and I've got it on Google docs - I'll link to it but ffs you've got to download your own copy and edit it. People keep asking for access to it - NO, you'll eff it all up. The yellow cells are ones you should change but realistically you should only change the bleach strength and maybe the custom amount of water. There's crap in that file I should remove, really, and cells I should make uneditable but that would make things too easy and I need the hate from people who can't use it. You can use citric acid instead of vinegar in the supporter's version**.


AND - if you buy thin bleach and it looks a little too yellowy and thicker than water put the cap on, shake it and have a look inside. If there are persistent bubbles like you'd get from washing up liquid DON'T use it for no-rinse sanitiser as it's still got surfactant in it that thick bleach has. It won't be no-rinse any more, it'll be a makes my beer taste like a vinyl record covered in plasters sanitiser.

** little nod to them in the know, there.
Cannot open spreadsheet link, it is ok, thanks for trying
 

Garmostripel

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By all the gods in Ásgardr, don’t use washing up liquid. Not on your fv, not on your long handled spoon and not on your pint glass. Just use water and a soft cloth, clean like a chef. Use it, clean it. This way nothing will get so caked on that a bit of water won’t remove it. Then use a good no rinse san to get yourself ready for the next brew day.
Hi,
I’ve used Milton to sanitize after use and then again on the next brew, used for barrel and bottles.
I’ve washed bottles with washing up liquid first then rinsed and sanitized. The head retention with the bottled beer was poor could this be not enoughrinsing?
 

Fireside Ales Homebrewery

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Hi,
I’ve used Milton to sanitize after use and then again on the next brew, used for barrel and bottles.
I’ve washed bottles with washing up liquid first then rinsed and sanitized. The head retention with the bottled beer was poor could this be not enoughrinsing?
It sounds like the most likely reason. As I say, I would not use washing up liquid on anything other than my regular dishes. And this is the reason..... This photo is of my Raven Porter. Poured straight from the Keg 🍻
FC7C0721-37A2-4A86-85F5-287D1044019E.jpeg
 

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MyQul

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No trouble at all, the link is courtesy of @MyQul to be honest and comes from another thread discussing sanitisation and alternatives to Star San. I have since given the links instruction a go and have found it to be very successful.
Historically though I have just used water to clean and a no rinse san like ChemSan or StarSan. 🍻

Ive never tried it as I use star san. Glad its worked for you
 

Scottyburto

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I can't believe I've been using washing up liquid all these years and only just hearing this! It clearly explains head inconsistency in my bottles, ie some rinsed more than others more washing up liquid in some than others! God damn u fairy baby!!!

If it affects surface tension would it affect hydrometer readings?
 

Fireside Ales Homebrewery

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I can't believe I've been using washing up liquid all these years and only just hearing this! It clearly explains head inconsistency in my bottles, ie some rinsed more than others more washing up liquid in some than others! God damn u fairy baby!!!

If it affects surface tension would it affect hydrometer readings?
It shouldn’t do. A hydrometer measures sugar ratio in a liquid. I am not sure that surface tension plays too much of a part. Though I might be wrong.
 

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