Corny Keg - Force carbonation

[bilhound]

First of all, apologies - I assume there are many posts floating about in the archives regarding this but I can't seem to find a definitive answer.

System = 19L corny, 6.5kg CO2, Beer fridge with inkbird, temp set to 6deg C, beer is a summer lightning clone brewed AG.

Have just begun force carbonation - rigged up the keg to the gas, set to 30psi then give it a few good shakes every now and then (no real 'system').

My questions - if anyone can answer them

How long do I need to continue this before it becomes 'carbonated'?

Once carbonated, can I then disconnect the keg and leave it stored until I'm ready to drink it? EG - a BBQ in 2 months time? Or will I need to force carb it all over again nearer the time!

 

[Robbo100]

From my limited experience (I have done 4 batches in Cornys so far), you will only need a couple of hours at 30 PSI, if you are shaking it regularly and have it on its side to maximise the fluid surface area. Make sure your gas disconnect has a NRV if it is on its side with the gas pipe connected otherwise you will get gas in your lines.

The problem with this method, is that you don't actually want your beer at 30 PSI because it is far too fuzzy. If you force carb for too long and store, then your beer will be too lively. So it is better to force carb to an under-carbed state and then allow the last bit of carbonation to occur slower at normal pressures.

One question. If you are serving in 2 months time, why do you need to force carb? If it is because you only have one air line, then you would be better off serving your current beer without the air line connected (to keep your new beer slowly carbing) and reconnecting it whenever the pressure drops and it slows down.

 

[Dads_Ale]

I also have my beer fridge set to 6c.

I connect the gas and take it up to 30psi then turn off the gas. I re-open the gas a couple of times a day until the pressure drops, due to absorption, to my desired value, usually 20 psi. I have a separate gauge in the gas in line to monitor the pressure in the keg. Once the 20psi equilibrium is reached I allow it to drop to serving pressure between 10 and 15 psi, opening the gas bottle as required. Your carbonation level and serving pressure will be dependant on personal preference for how fizzy you like your beer and the type of dispense system.

Obviously this method takes a bit longer but I don't like leaving the gas on all of the time and can't be bothered to shake or roll the keg once it is in the fridge. I also don't like the idea of getting beer into the gas in dip tube or PRV assembly during rolling.

 

[Godsdog]

I think robbo meant beer in the gas line rather than gas when lying the keg on its side,had it happen to me last week due to over filling the keg so the short gas dip tube was covered by the beer,not a pleasant experience and could f00k your gas gauge up

 

[glynb]

The colder the beer the quicker the co2 is absorbed into the liquid. I crash mine down to abut 3 or 4 deg, carb to 50psi, roll about the garden or room fo 5 mins or so, re-gas to 50psi again roll about.. leave to settle for a few hours then let all the gas out. I then only put enough gas back in to just push the beer out (approx 2 or 3 psi). Seems to work fine for an IPA but if you want more fizz for a lager or patersbier for example, it'll take you a good few more times or carbing and rolling.

You can connect it up to the gas at say 30 to 40 psi and just leave it at around a week.

I can never wait a week though as I just gotta start drinking it the same day :-?

 

[bilhound]

Cheers for the tips - I have had it set at 30psi and 6deg for 24 hours with minimal shaking so far. I've now turned the gas off at the bottle, but kept the 'valve' in it's place so the gauge still reads 30psi. I'm going to leave it at that, tomorrow evening I will zero the valve and then take it up to about 10psi for a trial pint tomorrow to see how it's done.

Is there anything I'm doing completely wrong? I'm not going to risk the keg going on its side, as I'm not certain I've got the correct valves etc to stop beer running the wrong way!

Cheers lads.

 

[glynb]

I'm not certain I've got the correct valves etc to stop beer running the wrong way!

Cheers lads.

Disconnect it and roll it about for 10 mins. It'd be good to drink after half an hour! :thumb:

 

[bilhound]

Disconnect it and roll it about for 10 mins. It'd be good to drink after half an hour! :thumb:

Tried this - however its pouring incredibly foamy! About 3/4 of the pint is foam straight out the tap.

Granted I tried the method above after leaving it connected to the gas at 30psi for 24 hrs so I wonder if I overdid it a bit.

If so - anyone know how to remedy this?

 

[glynb]

Let all the gas out via the valve and recarb just enough to push the beer out (1 or 2 psi?)

 

[bilhound]

Let all the gas out via the valve and recarb just enough to push the beer out (1 or 2 psi?)

Nice one - will give that a go and let you know how it goes!

 

[Spoon]

Let all the gas out via the valve and recarb just enough to push the beer out (1 or 2 psi?)

+1

It needs to be carbonated to about 15psig (assuming your gauges read gauge pressure not absolute, i.e. they don't add 14.7 to compensate for the 14.7psi of atmospheric pressure on the other side of the gauge) to give the usual 2.0 volumes of CO2. Either by filling to 50psi, shaking till it drops, repeat until it settles at 15psi, or just sticking 15psi in and being patient.

But to serve you need essentially zero pressure at the tap otherwise you get foam. So either turn the gas down to very low whilst dispensing, and back up again for storage. Or fit longer + thinner beer lines, or flow controllers which drops the pressure whilst beer is moving in the pipes as it increases friction but allows full pressure when it's stopped. Flow controllers can either be integrated with the tap or a separate john guest style fitting.

 

[bilhound]

So that worked a treat! Purged the gas, then wound it up gently to 3 psi. After 48 hours, I now have some beer pouring perfectly, not too much head and not too little. The only problem is now it seems to be disappearing quite quickly.... :drink:

Thanks all!

 

[DaveBeds]

Awesome work billhound!

I'm also about to do my first corny keg brew and am a bit nervous about the force carb bit.

It's a Woodfordes Sundew kit.

I'm thinking about doing the following, grateful for advice from more experienced bods on here!

- place FV in fridge once done (around 2 weeks) for 24 hours

- rack straight into Corny

- 30 mins at 25psi, pressure connected and rolling on my knees

- 12 hours in fridge at 10psi

- bleed down to 5 psi for 2 days

- reduce to serving pressure (2 - 4psi) and enjoy straight from fridge!

Does that sound sensible?

Much appreciated all!

 

[Spoon]

Unless you want beer right there and then, there isn't so much need to put so much pressure in it or roll it around. Just set your regulator to the pressure you want and leave it for a couple of days. 10psi is moderately flat, 20psi would be quite fizzy, 15psi would be about what you'd get in a bottle conditioned ale (2 carbonation volumes). It only takes a couple of days to carbonate at 'normal' pressures and serving temperatures. It took almost as long for my kegs to warm up in the kegerator (no heater in there) after cold crashing and racking as it did to carbonate.

Also it depends on what taps you're serving from.

If it's from a 'picnic tap' on a short hose then you need to carb it to whatever pressure you want it to be (10-20psi depending how much fizz you want) then vent it and turn it down to 2-3psi to serve, any more and it'll be like trying to serve beer from a hosepipe (and a lot of foam). Once you've finished serving you then put the pressure back upto the carbonation pressure (10-20psi) to stop if going flat.

If it's a bar with faucets then you can either use a long run of thin beer line, or a flow restrictor in the line which reduces the keg pressure (10-20psi) down to the 3psi or so that the tap needs, without any foam.

The second is the 'correct' way of doing things because you don't have to vent a load of CO2 every time you want a beer. But does need more bits. You could put a flow restrictor on a picnic tap, but I'm not sure if the lines would be the right diameter, mine have a 6mm or 5/16" outlet and my picnic tap is made from what looks like hosepipe!

 

[DaveBeds]

Huge thanks Spoon, that's great advice. I guess I'll just have to keep working on the patience bit as having beer right here, right now, is where I am at the moment!

So, based on the below, I think I'll rack straight to the keg without chilling first, purge with CO2 a few times, then put it in the fridge with around 15psi (it's a light IPA, and I prefer my beers slightly more fizzy and cooler - terrible confession, I know....), and leave it well alone for a few days. Then see what happens!

I have a bar faucet. But, it's connected directly to the QD on the outlet. Is that less than ideal?

Massive thanks again!