query on the priming calcs

[chuffer]

Ive looked at two online priming calcs which suggest that if my bottles are kept in a relatively warmer environment than normal, I'd need more sugar than if it were in a cooler environment. Is this correct? Seems counterintuitive to me

 

[Gerryjo]

Do yourself a little experiment and try priming with different amounts in certain bottles but condition all at the same temperature too see what works best for you.

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[chuffer]

Do yourself a little experiment and try priming with different amounts in certain bottles but condition all at the same temperature too see what works best for you.

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No need, obviously at the same temp the more sugar the more carbonation. That's not what I was asking

 

[MrN]

I think the temperature actually refers to the temp of the beer at the time of bottling, rather than temp it'll be stored at. I believe this is because beer that's colder will have more co2 in solution already whereas as it warms up the co2 comes out of solution therefore you need to add more co2 when carbonating (i.e. add more priming sugar)

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[DoctorMick]

I think the temperature actually refers to the temp of the beer at the time of bottling, rather than temp it'll be stored at. I believe this is because beer that's colder will have more co2 in solution already whereas as it warms up the co2 comes out of solution therefore you need to add more co2 when carbonating (i.e. add more priming sugar)

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That's how I understand it too.

 

[chuffer]

I think the temperature actually refers to the temp of the beer at the time of bottling, rather than temp it'll be stored at. I believe this is because beer that's colder will have more co2 in solution already whereas as it warms up the co2 comes out of solution therefore you need to add more co2 when carbonating (i.e. add more priming sugar)

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Ok cheers but that would suggest it doesn't matter what temp you store at as long as you've balanced the amount of sugar with the temp of the brew at bottling. Yet ive read elsewhere that if you need more carbonation, you need to move your bottles somewhere warm? Suggesting warmer temps equates to more carbonation given a fixed amount of priming sugar?

 

[strange-steve]

Yet ive read elsewhere that if you need more carbonation, you need to move your bottles somewhere warm? Suggesting warmer temps equates to more carbonation given a fixed amount of priming sugar?

The beer has to be kept warm while carbonation is taking place, usually for a couple of weeks after adding the priming sugar. After that is complete, the storage temperature will not have any effect. The level of carbonation depends on how much sugar you add and how much disolved CO2 there is already in the beer at bottling time, which is why calculators ask for temperature.

 

[IainM]

The reason for having them somewhere warm is so that the yeast is active enough to turn the sugar to CO2. The yeast should eat all the priming sugar, so storage temperature will have no effect on the level of carbonation. As Steve says, the carbonation level is determined by the amount of sugar and the amount of CO2 already in the beer. This depends on the temperature, with colder beer holding more CO2. This is why putting a lower temp into the calculator results in it suggesting less sugar. It is worth bearing in mind that no new CO2 is made after primary fermentation is finished, so if you ferment at 20C then cold crash to 5C before bottling, then 20C is the value you should use for the calc even though you are bottling at 5C.

 

[strange-steve]

It is worth bearing in mind that no new CO2 is made after primary fermentation is finished, so if you ferment at 20C then cold crash to 5C before bottling, then 20C is the value you should use for the calc even though you are bottling at 5C.

Quite right, and this causes a lot of confusion. In most cases it won't be a problem, but for styles where the temperature is ramped up you can sometimes end up with under carbed beer if you don't know what temperature to put into the calculator. You should use the highest temperature the beer was at after fermentation is complete.

 

[chuffer]

Ah ok, thanks for the replies! I recently had a lager which fermented at 11 then had a diacetyl raise to 18-20 then dropped to 1 and lagered for a few weeks in secondary. Now, when I came to bottle I thought the temp to use in the calc would be room temp (I.e. The temp bottles would carbonate for 2 weeks at), but from what I'm now hearing, I should have used 11 (fermenting temp) or would you count the temp at diacetyl rest as being the temp to use?

 

[IainM]

Ah ok, thanks for the replies! I recently had a lager which fermented at 11 then had a diacetyl raise to 18-20 then dropped to 1 and lagered for a few weeks in secondary. Now, when I came to bottle I thought the temp to use in the calc would be room temp (I.e. The temp bottles would carbonate for 2 weeks at), but from what I'm now hearing, I should have used 11 (fermenting temp) or would you count the temp at diacetyl rest as being the temp to use?

The temp to use is the diacetyl rest one.

 

[strange-steve]

You should use the highest temperature, 18-20 because the diacetyl rest should be done after fermentation so there will be no more CO2 being produced to dissolve into solution. At lower temperatures the beer will hold more disolved CO2 but it won't absorb it from the atmosphere, it has to be produced by the yeast in order to be absorbed. That's why lowering the temperature after fermentation like you did for lagering should be ignored.

 

[chuffer]

Great, thanks. Well coincidentally, the diacetyl rest temp was quite close to the room carbonating temp anyway. On this occasion my ignorance may well have gone unpunished, thankfully