Cider yeast

cheshirehomebrew · Mar 8, 2016

Hello all, first time in this part of the forum as I brew beer not cider, however a friend of mine does and he was wondering the best yeast to use for his cider.

His current batch was brewed using a wine yeast and it has left the cider on the rather dry side (think kalahari) so I said i would ask those in the know.

He is looking to make something not too dry, and has planted 8 ish trees he got from somewhere in Worcestershire, all cider apples of varying types.

so folks over to you !

cheapbrew · Mar 8, 2016

Cider yeast usually finishes around 1.000, whereas wine yeast usually finishes around 990, so using a wine yeast will make very dry cider.

I usually use Young's cider yeast, or from wilko.

pomme homme · Mar 8, 2016

Is it possible to buy bayanus yeast other than in 5g sachets in order to reduce the cost for making larger batches of cider? If so, can anyone tell me by whom larger quantities are sold and the best price for those?

terrym · Mar 8, 2016

'Traditional' cider is made without addition of extra yeast, it relies on the naturally occurring yeast on the apples, that's what cider makers do. Someone I know makes cider from apples from his orchard like this, so it does work on a small scale too.
So if your friend is making cider from his own apples he may not need any extra yeast.

cheshirehomebrew · Mar 9, 2016

Brilliant, many thanks. I have told him before that nautural yeast will do the job all of its own, well you don't grow up in Somerset without knowing a little about cider now do you :)

brumbrew · Mar 9, 2016

I've made cider with no yeast and it tasted off, kind of musty. Wild yeast can be a hit or miss kind of affair.

I'd favour the campden tablet route, followed by gv13 the day after.

VW911 · Mar 9, 2016

I used to work as a cider maker in Somerset, and I would agree that an introduced cider yeast produces a far more uniform and consistent cider over wild yeasts.
I have always had good results with Young's cider yeast...

terrym · Mar 9, 2016

VW911 said:
I used to work as a cider maker in Somerset, and I would agree that an introduced cider yeast produces a far more uniform and consistent cider over wild yeasts.
I have always had good results with Young's cider yeast...

In that case looks like VW911 and Brumbrew above have best advice :thumb:

cheapbrew · Mar 9, 2016

If you want to make natural cider without adding yeast you have to have the right PH juice. A desirable juice PH range for cider-making is 3.2 - 3.8. At higher PH the fermentation will be subject to microbial infection and at pH 4.0 or above this can lead to serious flavour problems.

This is a good website for cider making info
http://www.cider.org.uk/sulphite.html
http://www.cider.org.uk/

brumbrew · Mar 9, 2016

cheapbrew said:
If you want to make natural cider without adding yeast you have to have the right PH juice. A desirable juice PH range for cider-making is 3.2 - 3.8. At higher PH the fermentation will be subject to microbial infection and at pH 4.0 or above this can lead to serious flavour problems.

This is a good website for cider making info
http://www.cider.org.uk/sulphite.html
http://www.cider.org.uk/

Nice! Thanks for that.

There's also lots of videos and tutorials about cider/fruit presses.

Mines just wood cobbled together with a car Jack as the means of squashing ;-)

terrym · Mar 9, 2016

brumbrew said:
Mines just wood cobbled together with a car Jack as the means of squashing ;-)

Just the approach I would take :thumb:

brumbrew · Mar 9, 2016

terrym said:
Just the approach I would take :thumb:

All liberated, found, borrowed and re perposed may I add.

Amazing what a bike ride around on bin day and bank holidays can yield. Even the odd 5ltr keg ;-)

pomme homme · Mar 9, 2016

The last batch of cider I made using 'natural' yeasts ended up as a first rate cider vinegar - which I use as a homeopathic tonic for my sheep! But if I want to make cider, rather than cider vinegar, I think that I'll stick to using commercial yeasts. So if anyone can answer my last question (@7:18 pm yesterday), I'll be most grateful.

cheshirehomebrew · Mar 10, 2016

VW911 said:
I used to work as a cider maker in Somerset, and I would agree that an introduced cider yeast produces a far more uniform and consistent cider over wild yeasts.
I have always had good results with Young's cider yeast...

Oh, whereabouts VW911 ?

and thank you all for all your help, looks like youngs cider yeast it is :thumb:

VW911 · Mar 10, 2016

cheshirehomebrew said:
Oh, whereabouts VW911 ?

and thank you all for all your help, looks like youngs cider yeast it is :thumb:

Was production supervisor for Orchard Pig, near Glastonbury. They still make some pretty good ciders...

brumbrew · Mar 10, 2016

pomme homme said:
The last batch of cider I made using 'natural' yeasts ended up as a first rate cider vinegar - which I use as a homeopathic tonic for my sheep! But if I want to make cider, rather than cider vinegar, I think that I'll stick to using commercial yeasts. So if anyone can answer my last question (@7:18 pm yesterday), I'll be most grateful.

I've had a cruise around Google and I can't seem to find much in the way of bulk. Sorry can't help you. Maybe buy a pack, use it and crop it yourself?

pomme homme · Mar 10, 2016

Thank you, brumbrew. That's a good idea but I've never before harvested yeast. How easy is it?

terrym · Mar 11, 2016

pomme homme said:
Thank you, brumbrew. That's a good idea but I've never before harvested yeast. How easy is it?

It's quite easy is the answer.
I've just cultured an ale yeast from a bottle of Shepheard Neame 1698, using MyQul's method.
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=60341 and
http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53567
It took just over 2 weeks from a hardly noticeable smear on the bottom of the bottle to about 140ml of yeast slurry ready for pitching.
However this uses DME to make up the wort needed. If you are culturing cider yeast I suppose it would logical to substitute apple juice for malt wort and follow the same method. Also if you are starting with a packet of yeast you are already a good way along the process.
The only concern I had related to the danger of contamination by wild yeasts even though I followed all the precautions to mitigate against it, although I have got no reason to believe the culture did get contaminated.

cheshirehomebrew · Mar 11, 2016

VW911 said:
Was production supervisor for Orchard Pig, near Glastonbury. They still make some pretty good ciders...

Have been up here in Cheshire for almost 20 years now so haven't heard of Orchard Pig, haha near Glastonbury could be Street, Meare, Westhay, Pilton, Polsham (although they have a vinyard) etc.

Thats pretty much were I grew up, well 5 miles down the road, al my cider I used to get (and still do) is from Heck's in Street

VW911 · Mar 11, 2016

cheshirehomebrew said:
Have been up here in Cheshire for almost 20 years now so haven't heard of Orchard Pig, haha near Glastonbury could be Street, Meare, Westhay, Pilton, Polsham (although they have a vinyard) etc.

Thats pretty much were I grew up, well 5 miles down the road, al my cider I used to get (and still do) is from Heck's in Street

West Bradley, near Baltonsborough. I currently work in Somerton, and live in Langport...

Heck's is still going strong!!!

Cider yeast

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