Conan x WLP644 Hybrid Yeast

Discussion in 'Grain, Hops, Yeast & Water' started by strange-steve, Jun 4, 2017.

  1. Jun 4, 2017 #1

    strange-steve

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    Anyone who keeps an eye on the Homebrewtalk forum may have come across a thread regarding this. But basically a brewing scientist from Finland called Kristoffer has bred a hybrid of the conan yeast (as used by Alchemist) and WLP644 (sacch trois) in an attempt to create a great IPA yeast. Every now and then he propagates a fresh batch and sells vials to anyone interested. This isn't a blend of the two yeasts but rather a new strain bred from the other two which I found intriguing (his blog post about it).

    I emailed him some time last year and he told me he was all out but would let me know next time round. I forgot all about it until he emailed a couple of weeks ago saying he was preparing a new batch. It cost €6 for a 2ml vial including shipping, and as well as the original hybrid strain (known as F1) he also included a vial which contains a variation on the original (known as F1C4). I think that's a bargain for two new strains to play with.

    I'm not really sure what the difference is between the two, he describes the variant as "the best performing segregant", which no doubt means something to a microbiologist, but not to me. The thread on homebrewtalk has lots of replies from brewers who have used them and the F1 has been described as "conan on steroids" with lots of peach, mango and orange. The F1C4 variant is a little more "brett" like, with a bit of funk but still very fruity, particularly pineapple which is common in 100% brett IPAs.

    I'm excited to try these out because they sound like exactly what I'm looking for in my NEIPA beers, and people seem to be having lots of success using these yeasts with this style (there was one guy who had bagged 3 medals for his IPA, BIPA and NEIPA). So I'm going to document my experiences here, starting from the 2ml vials right up to the finished beers. I don't have a particular recipe in mind yet, but I'm probably going to do a slightly simpler version of my vermont IPA, split the batch and pitch the two strains for a comparison. I will also be happy to send some bottles to those interested in trying it.

    I'm in the middle of buying a house so brewing has taken a back seat recently, but I'm keen to get started on this soon. More details to follow.
     
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  2. Jun 4, 2017 #2

    clarkeuk

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    I would love to try some Steve will obviously send some back in return

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  3. Jun 4, 2017 #3

    strange-steve

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    I received the vials yesterday and I got the first starters going this evening. They were supposed to be 50ml but I had some spillage so probably about 30-40ml each. I'll give them a couple of days at 20° then step up to 100ml.
    [​IMG]
     
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  4. Jun 4, 2017 #4

    strange-steve

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    Sure, it'll be a couple of months probably before I'm at that stage but I'll keep you in mind :thumb:
     
  5. Jun 4, 2017 #5

    clarkeuk

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    Look forward to it cheers👍🍻

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  6. Jun 4, 2017 #6

    clarkeuk

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    Look forward to it cheers Steve 👍🍻

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  7. Jun 4, 2017 #7

    IainM

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    Sounds very interesting. I'd be very happy to do a bottle swap on one of those!
     
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  8. Jun 5, 2017 #8

    RKi

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    God sounds incredibly interesting. Think theres any chance he'd send some of the yeast to a random such as myself?
     
  9. Jun 5, 2017 #9

    strange-steve

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    I don't see why not, I got his email from the first post in the HBT thread linked above. I think there's a lot of interest so it's possible you may have to wait till next time (as I did) but you might be lucky if you speak to him soon.
     
  10. Jun 6, 2017 #10

    strange-steve

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    Just in case anyone on the forum is still interested in brewing rather than politics and religion (:D) I stepped these up to 100ml this evening. Obviously not much to see at this point but there seemed to be some off-gassing when I swirled it up which is a good sign of life. Another couple of days then I'll step up to 250ml.
     
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  11. Jun 20, 2017 #11

    Gerryjo

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    Whats your limit on a starter prior to pitching out of curiosity?

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  12. Jun 20, 2017 #12

    strange-steve

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    I forgot to update this, but this is how they now look after fermenting out at 250ml and a few days in the fridge to settle out. There's a decent layer of yeast there, so I reckon a another step up to 1L should be enough to split a batch between them.
    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Jun 20, 2017 #13

    strange-steve

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    Not sure what you mean by that, how long I leave it or how big?
     
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  14. Jun 20, 2017 #14

    Gerryjo

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    Good answer so now I'll say both as I'm a complete nube when it comes to yeast strains and their attributes.

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  15. Jun 20, 2017 #15

    strange-steve

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    When it comes to size, if the starter is up to 10% of the batch volume then I just chuck the lot in, if it's bigger than that then it's probably best to chill the starter for a day or so, decant off the liquid and just pitch the yeast from the bottom.

    As for time, I usually make the starter the day before brewday however you could make it a week or so in advance then keep it in the fridge till you need it without doing much harm. I always find less lag with a fresh starter though.
     
  16. Jun 20, 2017 #16

    Gerryjo

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    Excellent shall certainly bear that in mind as I have a few yeast cakes I'm looking to harvest over the next week or so.
    An educational thread and one I shall be watching.
    Cheers.

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  17. Jul 22, 2017 #17

    strange-steve

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    Well various annoying things got in the way of this for a while but I'm back on the case now. I have ordered the ingredients for the NEIPA that I'm using these in and am hoping to brew on Wednesday so today I've stepped these up a little to 500ml then on Monday or Tuesday I'll step up again to 1L. Unfortunately these yeasts have been in the fridge for about a month now, so really not the ideal way to treat it but it was just bad timing.

    Those who are on my list to try these:
    @Tobiasbeecher
    @Iainm
    @Clarkeuk
    @Jon474
    @Krispn
    @Ajhutch
    @stigman

    Let me know if I've forgotten anyone.
     
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  18. Jul 22, 2017 #18

    stigman

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    I've just put my NEIPA on cold crash today I'll send you a bottle when I get a minute.

    I've used Wlp007 English ale for the first time and its the weirdest looking yeast I've seen, looks like cottage cheese or something whilst on the stir plate, switch off and 20/30 seconds later it's settled into a mass.
     

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  19. Jul 22, 2017 #19

    stigman

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    I over built this starter so when I took a half litre I would have over a hundred billion cells but there's no way I could just decant some off. So I resorted to leaving it on the plate and sucking some up with a turkey baster,didn't work very well and now I don't know how many cells I've got for my next stater. Here's a pic any idea's?
     

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  20. Jul 22, 2017 #20

    strange-steve

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    I don't know mate, sorry. One thing that really upsets my inner perfectionist is the uncertainty of yeast cell counts. I try to comfort myself by reasoning that it doesn't matter that much in the end, but that doesn't really help tbh. I'm having the same crisis with these 2 hybrid strains, absolutely no idea what the cell count is and it's annoying me far more than it should!
     

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