Confused about flame out additions

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Libigage

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Not yet done an all grain brew, only kits and one partial mash. Doing alot ot research about hop additions and timings. The One thing is confusing me is the flame out addition, so how long do you leave that hop in after flame out as I'm led to believe that once you turn it off you cool the wort as quickly as possible then transfer to the fv, obviously filtering out the hops. Is this true. Surely if I was doing a 1 gallon batch I could have that cooled in 10-15 minutes, if that.
 

Clint

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I chill to 80c,chuck the hops in and leave them for about 20 minutes..stir occasionally.
 

moto748

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I don't even understand what the term 'flame-out' means.

Anyone, please?
 

RichardM

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Not yet done an all grain brew, only kits and one partial mash. Doing alot ot research about hop additions and timings. The One thing is confusing me is the flame out addition, so how long do you leave that hop in after flame out as I'm led to believe that once you turn it off you cool the wort as quickly as possible then transfer to the fv, obviously filtering out the hops. Is this true. Surely if I was doing a 1 gallon batch I could have that cooled in 10-15 minutes, if that.
Don't get hung up with that. Some people don't chill their wort at all, they put it in a jerry can and leave it to chill overnight.
With flame out hops put them in at about 80c (putting them in earlier will result in a more bitter beer), pause your chilling for half an hour or so, then carry on as usual.
 

Zephyr259

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Adding a 80c is good for max flavour and minimising bitterness but you can also go the simple option of just throwing them in at the end of the boil then chilling either immediately or after a pause. Since I brew in a grainfather I add as soon as the boil is done then whirlpool rapidly and leave everything to settle for around 15 mins while I sanitise the fermenter. I do this becuase without letting things settle the pump filter is easily blocked. I could chill a bit first but that isn't ideal with a counterflow chiller so I don't, but then I also don't brew heavily hopped beers so I'm not extracting a lot of bitterness from flame-out additions. Finally, I don't think I've done a flame-out addition in over a year as my hoppy beers have been using a 15/10/5 minute addition schedule.
 

AlDaviz

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Not yet done an all grain brew, only kits and one partial mash. Doing alot ot research about hop additions and timings. The One thing is confusing me is the flame out addition, so how long do you leave that hop in after flame out as I'm led to believe that once you turn it off you cool the wort as quickly as possible then transfer to the fv, obviously filtering out the hops. Is this true. Surely if I was doing a 1 gallon batch I could have that cooled in 10-15 minutes, if that.
A decent read. I was quite lucky, I was able to buy a grainfather when I started and all but one brew where I had some contamination has went well. There’s plenty of help from the forum and some good stuff on YouTube that can help. I tend to be able to brew once a month and used some of brewdogs recipes as a guide. Good luck with your brewing athumb..
 

Edison

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I think usually it's supposed to mean throw them in as soon as you've got to the end of your allocated boil time and chill immediately. The wort will quickly get below the temperature to extract bitterness and stay longer in the range to extract the fragile flavours and aromas without these oils vaporising out. There is a bit of personal interpretation to it though.
I opt for a more accurate chill to 75c and then add the hops and circulate for at least 20 mins. This can give you similar results to dry hopping but keeps your fv cleaner.
 

smcc

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i also go down to 75 and then add, just a bit anal and read in my new ipa book about some experiments with flame out additions and temps. basically the time it takes to cool is how long they are in for.
 

Galena

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Just done a flameout addition today as it happens, some recipes call for it and some don't.
Basically I put the immersion chiller in with 15 mins of the boil left to make sure it's sanitised then as soon as the heat goes off (flameout) I turn the water on to the chiller, it is very quick to drop to 80C so you need to be ready to turn it off quickly.
Then add the hops and maintain 80C (or whatever temperature you have targeted) for the time required, today I did a 10 minute hopstand.
The idea is it is still hot enough to pasturise so it won't get infected.
As soon as the time is up the chiller goes back on and the lid goes on once it gets to 70C
 

RichardM

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Don't get hung up with that. Some people don't chill their wort at all, they put it in a jerry can and leave it to chill overnight.
With flame out hops put them in at about 80c (putting them in earlier will result in a more bitter beer), pause your chilling for half an hour or so, then carry on as usual.
After thinking about it, flame out hops go in as soon as you have turned the heat off, whirlpool hops go in at about 80centigrade.
 

Cwrw666

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I chuck em in as soon as I've turned the boiler off then leave it alone for half an hour before draining into the FV.
I also do some Victorian brews that have hop additions only at 90, 60 and 30 minutes. They have loads of hop aroma and flavour. My conclusion is that whatever you do will have minimal difference. I expect plenty of people will throw their hands up in horror at that...
 

the baron

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to help you understand some of the terms Flameout is exactly what it says when you turn the flame of heat out or the electric heating element off- usually as you say it is chilled straight away so that the hops do not impart too much bitterness as this release of the bitterness from the hops is generally thought to stop at 80C approx so after that while you are still chilling the hops are still adding flavour/aroma and no further bitterness. Some of the other suggestions are probably not helping you to understand but they are advising you to chuck the hops in at 80c so to explain that it is called whirlpool hopping and is done at 80c or lower as a general rule for the same reasons I have said above i.e they do not impart bitterness but add flavour/aroma.
So it is your choice whether to Flameout or Whirlpool, it is more common nowadays to whirlpool at around 80c to get extra flavour/aroma and not affecting your IBU's/bitterness too much.
Hope this helps as some of the answers are just giving you advice on what they think you should do without helping you to understand the difference between the 2 ways - Flameout to Whirlpool.
Ps I would Whirlpool as it allows a larger amount of hops to be used (ideal for hoppy beers) without giving too much bitterness to the brew
 

moto748

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Thanks for the clarification guys. Like, I suspect, quite a few people, I don't do any 'chilling' at all; the heat is turned off and the boiling wort poured onto sugar (if used) in the bucket. Then I give it a good stir, and leave it overnight loosely covered. Then the next day, check the temp, and pitch the yeast. And that has always worked fine for me. But following on the baron's explanation, I guess I could chuck another handful of hops in, say first thing in the morning when the temp is about 80 deg
 

the baron

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Hi you wort will drop to 80C pretty quickly say as a estimate 20 to 30mins I would do your whirlpool then and transfer to your FV/Bucket and leave to cool overnight.
Ps I remove my hops obviously after the set whirlpool time and do not leave them in to cool overnight this gives you more control over your hopping so that you can reproduce/tweak your recipe next time with more accuracy
 

Libigage

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Right so if I let it drop to 80°,then put the hops in and leave for about 20 mins. Do I then stir continuously to get a whirlpool effect or just stir occasionally? (don't laugh its a serious question). I take it that the expensive kit does the whirlpool for you.
 

the baron

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Well you can just add the hops and stir or you can put the hops in a bag or hop spider so that you can remove them easier. Leaving them in is ok as long as you can remove them before going to the FV/Cube IMO some will say leave them in and transfer them to the Cube/FV but you may get more flavours from the hops and have no control of the IBU's.
I have a all in one brewing system so as I said I put them in a hop spider and put the recirculating pump on so that it recircs into the hop spider which agitates the hops and saves on stirring.
If you do not have recirc facilities just put them in a large hop bag and stir them during your 20 minutes now and again so as to make sure they are well dissolved or soaked. I f you do not use a bag/spider just whirlpool with a large spoon/paddle after your 20 mins and leave to settle for a while before doing the transfer this should make most of the hops sit in the middle of the brew kettle
 

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I used to use hop bags but now I just chuck all my hops in (pellets). I usually stir just after adding them and then leave it for 20 mins and don't really stir it much. Then I chill and filter it with a sanitised Aldi veg bag or two into the FV. It seems to get a slightly better result to my mind than using a hop bag.
 

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