Coopers vs. John Bull kits

[terrym]

Much as I like and use Coopers kits I have to say when I compare their IPA with the John Bull IPA and the Coopers English Bitter vs. JB Traditional English Bitter I would go for the JB kits every time. There's a burnt malt taste about both of the Coopers kits which I don't get on with, which is not so pronounced with the JB equivalents, if it's there at all. Plus you get a bit more liquid malt with the JB kits and they are usually cheaper, certainly in the Tesco sales. I haven't tried the JB Best Bitter yet, perhaps I should.
What do others think?

 

[Covrich]

I never did any JB kits but I have tried a few my dad did, most recently the Bitter and the lager.. in the Kits defence he for some reason brews with kit and kilo. But if I was honest they were okay to drink but did have that twang which you can get with HB.... I think sugar and any one can kit though isn't going to give anyone the best impression..

I did a canadian coopers blonde which was again okay but it needed pimping up.. I tried someone else IPA from coopers (they had dry hopped) and that was decent enough

If I was picking one again to do I would lean towards coopers, but I would pimp it up or pick a premium kit,, I felt the premium kits I did were better.

A lot of people here really like JB kits

 

[LarryF]

I've done three out of the four, I've never done the Coopers IPA. Saying that though the Coopers English Bitter is a brilliant kit for a new brewer, it was the first one I ever "got right" so it does hold a special place in my heart. It's a beer that tastes nice very early and when you're doing your first ever brew that's a biggie. I've done another one since and I think it's a brilliant platform for hop teas and dry hopping if new brewers (or old brewers TBH) want to go down that road. Saying that though I've done both of the John Bull Kits and they are stunners, the IPA and Best Bitters have to be some of the best one can kits I've done, they just seem to get it all right. When you think that you can pick these up for £9 a pop in the Tesco Sale it's mind blowing. I'm wondering if it's worth doing a Toucan at that price but the hop profile might be a concern. I'm currently drinking the John Bull Traditional Ale and it's different to the the Best and IPA, it's seems a bit flatter but it is growing on me and the more of them I have the more I'm enjoying them. I have a feeling it'll be a brew where I'm weeping into my last glass of it that I didn't leave it all four months and then start drinking them.

 

[junior1]

I live the coopers pale ale which I used some Northern brewer hops OMG what a lovely pint with a perfect head all the way down when finished. I'm going to do another very soon

 

[coopsy]

Coopers every time for me, the English Bitter a real winner, and a great brew to experiment with....

 

[Slid]

I must admit that despite having had many sales opportunities on JB kits, I have always gone for the Coopers.

 

[terrym]

Small but interesting set of views there. Among the one can kits Coopers have a well earned reputation especially for reliability, the range they produce and the capacity for experimentation like I do with additional grains and hops. I wonder if JB suffer from a belief that, because the name has been around for so long and they are cheap, they are still like kits used to be i.e. rubbish! Just a thought....

 

[Sandimas]

I wonder if JB suffer from a belief that, because the name has been around for so long and they are cheap, they are still like kits used to be i.e. rubbish! Just a thought....

I think you're right. I remember John Bull keg bitter from the 70s and 80s and can't get it out of my head, hence never buying a JB kit. They could be the best kits in the world but that association and the 70s-style branding on the tins has put me off.

 

[Slid]

Small but interesting set of views there. Among the one can kits Coopers have a well earned reputation especially for reliability, the range they produce and the capacity for experimentation like I do with additional grains and hops. I wonder if JB suffer from a belief that, because the name has been around for so long and they are cheap, they are still like kits used to be i.e. rubbish! Just a thought....

Very astute observation, here, Terry, as that is almost exactly why I have never bought one. Though I never actually thought of it that way.

Could be very useful in a partial mash brew, so I will wait until the next sale :thumb:

 

[LarryF]

Very astute observation, here, Terry, as that is almost exactly why I have never bought one. Though I never actually thought of it that way.

Could be very useful in a partial mash brew, so I will wait until the next sale :thumb:

I'd love to hear what you could do with them Slid, they're 1.8kg kits and I really like them.

 

[Slid]

I'd love to hear what you could do with them Slid, they're 1.8kg kits and I really like them.

You can do a partial mash with a large stock pot and a nylon bag. It is basically clibit's 10L AG approach plus a kit. Here is clibit's second version:

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=57692

I recall setting out in much detail how I use my pot (15L capacity, 12.5L boil limit, from Wilko, currently £17) plus a BIAB bag and the oven, to mash, sparge and boil. I still do the same.

I posted some details of earlier brews here, before I got fed up of just replicating similar ideas on the forum.

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53598

 

[LarryF]

You can do a partial mash with a large stock pot and a nylon bag. It is basically clibit's 10L AG approach plus a kit. Here is clibit's second version:

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=57692

I recall setting out in much detail how I use my pot (15L capacity, 12.5L boil limit, from Wilko, currently �£17) plus a BIAB bag and the oven, to mash, sparge and boil. I still do the same.

I posted some details of earlier brews here, before I got fed up of just replicating similar ideas on the forum.

http://www.thehomebrewforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=53598

Slid, I was lucky enough to get a 21L pot and bag from one of the guys on here for £26 delivered, result. I've dipped my toe in the AG world on I'm on AG2 now but my last raid on the Tesco Sale means I've got kits and BE to last me until the end of May so my AG is on hold until then after this one. One thing's been bugging me and it's the fact that I like doing kits and a partial mash is a nice bit of both worlds, I'm sure 2 1/2kg of grain with a kit bought on sale would work out about 25p a pint, I can live with that.

 

[Slid]

Slid, I was lucky enough to get a 21L pot and bag from one of the guys on here for �£26 delivered, result. I've dipped my toe in the AG world on I'm on AG2 now but my last raid on the Tesco Sale means I've got kits and BE to last me until the end of May so my AG is on hold until then after this one. One thing's been bugging me and it's the fact that I like doing kits and a partial mash is a nice bit of both worlds, I'm sure 2 1/2kg of grain with a kit bought on sale would work out about 25p a pint, I can live with that.

Larry,

The best of it is that there is not that much difference between a PM and an AG. Certainly mashing some grains makes a significant difference to a kit. I might suggest doing a half-way house of PM - AG - PM and see if you feel it is worth that leap?

 

[LarryF]

My thinking exactly Slid, there was a very well made comment on here once on the subject of kit vs AG but I cannot remember who made it for the life of me. He said that the kit to workload compared to AG to workload ratio really worked in favour of kit brewing. Now, I've not done enough AG to say if the increase of quality in AG only brewing justifies the increased workload but in the same breath I'd have to say that kit brewing has a shelf life no matter how much you tweak your kits. I think that maybe as a brewer I brew tweaked kits, I brew partial mash kits and I brew AG and enjoy them all, brew it as the fancy takes me. I mean, grain's cheap enough, kits are cheap enough if you catch the sales, it's all there to be done.