Infection Question

[phildo79]

This might be a really daft question but I have an infected batch. The beer smells and tastes rank. The fv had obvious signs of infection and that has been cleaned, sterilised and sanitised. I will do the same with the donor keg once I have tipped the beer (I presume it will never come good?) but do I need to clean / chuck my regulator line? I will strip and clean the disconnect but just how far can these infections travel?

 

[chthon]

I will be pedantic and say: no, you do not have an infected batch, you have a contaminated batch.

When cheese grows mould in your fridge, you also don't say that your cheese is infected.

Actually, I don't mean it if I say I am being pedantic. Infection has only one meaning, and it is in the context of a living organism. Beer is food. In the context of food, it is always contamination.

I am pretty sure that nobody in the commercial and professional brewing industry talks about infection. Being professionals, they will have been taught about contamination, its mechanisms and its results.

Now, about your beer: what does 'smell rank' mean, how would you translate it? Is it mouldy or funky? Did you have a small taste of it? Does it taste mouldy, or does it taste acidic?

 

[phildo79]

I will be pedantic and say: no, you do not have an infected batch, you have a contaminated batch.

When cheese grows mould in your fridge, you also don't say that your cheese is infected.

Actually, I don't mean it if I say I am being pedantic. Infection has only one meaning, and it is in the context of a living organism. Beer is food. In the context of food, it is always contamination.

I am pretty sure that nobody in the commercial and professional brewing industry talks about infection. Being professionals, they will have been taught about contamination, its mechanisms and its results.

Now, about your beer: what does 'smell rank' mean, how would you translate it? Is it mouldy or funky? Did you have a small taste of it? Does it taste mouldy, or does it taste acidic?

So the nasties that caused the problem have not migrated to the donor keg? That would be good news.

As for the beer, I cannot for the life of me describe the aroma and taste. I have a list of off flavours that is almost 200 strong and none of them fit. It most definitely smells funky and "warm". The taste isn't acidic, just putrid and again, a funny horrible warmth to it. This is the second infection I have ever had and it's identical to the first one, which was about a year ago.

Just had another taste and it's sour with maybe a latex paint taste. Not that I have ever tasted latex paint.

 

[phildo79]

I think I may have found it. Some of these descriptions fit and I made a hash of the pH, getting it down to 5.5 before doughing in. Wtf was I thinking! Pretty sure this beer isn't going to come good.

 

[samale]

Goaty
That's a new one for me

 

[phildo79]

Goaty
That's a new one for me

Yeah, I'm not even sure what that is. It's so similar to the last infection that I am loathe to go through the entire list of faults. Because I did it last time and was still none the wiser.

 

[Sandimas]

Yeah, I'm not even sure what that is. It's so similar to the last infection that I am loathe to go through the entire list of faults. Because I did it last time and was still none the wiser.

Having been down this route a few times, I agree - you can end up chasing your tail. I did it for 18months once, and still never got to a satisfactory conclusion.

The description you provided sounds like by-product of the process rather than an infection, as any nasties would have been disposed of by the boil stage after the mash. Yet you said in the original poast "the fv had obvious signs of infection" which seems to counter this? It sounds like you may already be chasing your tail.

Best bet is to blitz everything, last time I had this it made it into 2 FVs and 3 kegs, I cleansed bit of the kit but not everything and kept getting re-infected from various sources. Only liberal use of a diluted bleach solution on everything finally sorted it out.

 

[phildo79]

Having been down this route a few times, I agree - you can end up chasing your tail. I did it for 18months once, and still never got to a satisfactory conclusion.

The description you provided sounds like by-product of the process rather than an infection, as any nasties would have been disposed of by the boil stage after the mash. Yet you said in the original poast "the fv had obvious signs of infection" which seems to counter this? It sounds like you may already be chasing your tail.

Best bet is to blitz everything, last time I had this it made it into 2 FVs and 3 kegs, I cleansed bit of the kit but not everything and kept getting re-infected from various sources. Only liberal use of a diluted bleach solution on everything finally sorted it out.

It had white spots all over the inside wall (I ferment in a 23L keg) and the underside of the lid, when I removed it, had an unusual array of condensation. That condensation smelled just like the beer.