Looking to go semi-automated

[Boilerman]

In an attempt to get some consistency, I'm looking at the idea of going semi-automated, but am at a loss as to where to start. Having gone through many threads and posts here, with no programming skills, is it worth using brewtroller to do the hard work for me? The reason for brewtroller is that looking at fellow brewers 'code' for their systems totally blows my mind; I've spent a few days trying to get my head around it but can't, hence brewtroller. Is there an alternative for someone with no programming skills?

If I go down the brewtroller route I know I can't buy it in the UK, luckily I have friends in the US who can source this for me an bring it over in the next couple of weeks. I'm now trying to compile a shopping list as to what else I need. My current set up is as follows

100lts HLT, 70lts Mash Tun, and 100lts boiler. In both the HLT and boiler I have 2 x 2.4kw elements which surprisingly work very well. I have a flow jet wort pump as well. It is my intention to go HERMS at some stage. If I'm not going with brewtroller, with this setup, is there anything else on the market I can use with no programming skills?

So to the shopping list

With four elements, do I need to have four SSR's?
3 temperature probes (HLT, MT and boiler) up to 5 when I go HERMS
LCD display
Som form of Brewtroller , suggestions welcome

Apologies for the long post, just looking for some advice as to where to go........

 

[bobsbeer]

Welcome to the forum : I have gone down the Brewtroller route and have the DX1. Yes you will need SSR's for all the elements you plan to use. Brewtroller can be as automated as you want. I've yet to use mine in anger yet as it has taken 6 months to plan, source and finally start building. Getting your friends in the USA will save you a good few quid in shipping and customs charges. I sourced my valves from China, but just before I ordered a guy on the brewtroller forum was selling his as he had changed his mind. But most of the other stuff came from OSCSYS.

It will involve a bit of code sorting depending on your exact setup. But there is lots of help out there so all you need to do is ask. There are now a few of us on the forum going down the brewtroller route. So you are not alone. Good luck. :thumb:

 

[anthonyUK]

There is also the BrewPi project - http://www.brewpi.com/
It requires less programming but also doesn't offer as much automation but it may be enough for you.

 

[stormybrew]

I was going to start a similar thread, will follow this one closely

 

[Fil]

google arduino and brewing.. lots of systems to copy n just use..

if u can pick up a bit of programming (its not difficult) u can cut n paste the best bits from anything u find....

 

[dennisdk2000]

google arduino and brewing.. lots of systems to copy n just use..

if u can pick up a bit of programming (its not difficult) u can cut n paste the best bits from anything u find....

This is what I'd like to do, only I'm not confident about my programming/electronics skills.

Dennis

 

[Fil]

the great thing about the arduino is virtually all the h/w u can attach has been attached and documented with a step by step component addition onto a breadboard and an interface library and an example program (sketch) to illustrate operation.

http://playground.arduino.cc/

for example temperature probes based on the ds18b20 only need a single resistor to wire in..

imo if u can map out what u want the system to do in any form and can sus programing such as If something do something and while something repeat something.. all the complex h/w interface stuff can be lifted straight from the example programs (sketches) using the programmers friend (cut n paste)

for example if u want to control a led to flash on and off or anything this is the example program that tells u how to do it..

/*
  Blink
  Turns on an LED on for one second, then off for one second, repeatedly.
 
  This example code is in the public domain.
 */

void setup() {                
  // initialize the digital pin as an output.
  // Pin 13 has an LED connected on most Arduino boards:
  pinMode(13, OUTPUT);     
}

void loop() {
  digitalWrite(13, HIGH);   // set the LED on
  delay(1000);              // wait for a second
  digitalWrite(13, LOW);    // set the LED off
  delay(1000);              // wait for a second
}

if u can follow that even if it takes a couple of cups of coffee, u can sus it all out.
clue (pins are the numbered connectors to the board...)

 

[Boilerman]

Thanks everyone

Am I right in assuming that brewtroller will do what I want it to do (initially) for example

Heat the HLT and maintain temperature
monitor the mash tun temp
When I do go HERMS, monitor the heat exchanger and keep a constant temperature
Heat and keep the boiler at a constant temperature?

Long term I'm looking at it filling the boiler, MT and boiler using pumps and valves

Regarding the code, I can kind of see what's happening in the above example. Has anyone got a sample code I can look at which for example would heat up the HLT and maintain it temperature?

Thanks very much
BM

 

[Fil]

Thanks everyone

Am I right in assuming that brewtroller will do what I want it to do (initially) for example

Heat the HLT and maintain temperature
monitor the mash tun temp
When I do go HERMS, monitor the heat exchanger and keep a constant temperature
Heat and keep the boiler at a constant temperature?

Long term I'm looking at it filling the boiler, MT and boiler using pumps and valves

Regarding the code, I can kind of see what's happening in the above example. Has anyone got a sample code I can look at which for example would heat up the HLT and maintain it temperature?

Thanks very much
BM

well it can be as simple as u want .. u can just wire a ssr onto a i/o pin and use basically the same code to turn an led on. - the ssr in turn would switch the hi load for the element.
OR. include the open source pid lib and make a call to it to decide when an element should be on..

heres some examples from code i lifted from jabba over on Jims..

#include <PID_v1.h>

includes the pid library of functions once downloaded and saved in your arduino ide folder.

double Setpoint, Input, Output;                     
PID myPID(&Input, &Output, &Setpoint,5,2,1, DIRECT);

defines the setpoint input and output vars and creates a Pid object myPID

now to use a pid u have to sus out what a pid does to an extent in essence decides whether an element should be on or off,,

so u define the setpoint (target temp) ie 71c strike temp for example. the input is the current temp of the pot, And Output is a number of milliseconds u can use to decide if or not the element should be on depending on the size of the time window u want to use.

Input = HLT_Temp;
   Setpoint = StrikeTempTarget;
   myPID.Compute();
   if(millis() - windowStartTime>WindowSize)
                  {   windowStartTime+=WindowSize;}
   if(Output > millis() - windowStartTime)  
          digitalWrite(HLTRelay,HIGH);
   else digitalWrite(HLTRelay,LOW);

bit more to chew on
millis() is a system call to get the current time count since boot in miliseconds
windowStartTime+=WindowSize
is short for
windowStartTime=windowStartTime+WindowSize

and the window size is the time period your basing your pid cycles on -- to use a pid u need to sus what a pid is a bit..

but that is all there is to it in essence..



And to answer the initial Q Yes the brewtroller system will do all that for you, u just have to buy all their custom h/w..

 

[Boilerman]

Thanks fil

Looks like it's getting a bit more in depth with the programming. With BT, I was under the impression I could get my SSR's temp probes elsewhere, all I needed from BT was the board?

I've sent them an email, it will be interesting on what they come back with

BM

 

[bobsbeer]

If you go the bt route then I would recommend also getting the i2c board and rotary controller. Makes life a lot easier. The pid displays are not a necessity as the temps etc can be read from the led display. But the brewtroller can be set up to as little or as much as you want. Once going you just use the rotary encoder to input options.

 

[anthonyUK]

I found this video very useful for explaining what a PID does.

[youtube:1cmhvpzz]XfAt6hNV8XM[/youtube:1cmhvpzz]

 

[Boilerman]

And what does the rotary controller and ic2 do for me bob and what's my shopping list going to be from them assuming I can get my temp probes and SSR's elsewhere?

(Sory if I'm repeating myself, just want to get the initial BT order right if I go that way)
BM

 

[Bopper]

If i can put my pennie's worth in! Brewtroller have taken things a few steps further, what i like really about it, is the volume level sensors, thus being able to read the volume of liquid in each vessel + plus for as control's you have MANUAL and AUTOMATIC for each function with a colour led to tell you what mode your in. I do not want to go into in too much depth as it start to get a bit complicated for those who haven't studied the forum. Hi Bobsbeer, we did meet on the other forum and you could shed more light on it.


Richard

 

[alby]

Others parts the brewtroller guys have that are worth considering

1. Heating element 5.5kw ultra low watt density = resists dry firing
https://brewtroller.com/store/product/c ... 0w-element

2. Probe ends are thermowells are a good price

Good system, unless your on a mission to become a software geek/genius or have a uni project to do this system is the easy way to go, someone else has done the leg work and will support you in times of need.

 

[Boilerman]

Thanks for all the great advice

Looks like I've got a few decisions to be made in the next few days as to going down the BT route.

BM

 

[bobsbeer]

And what does the rotary controller and ic2 do for me bob and what's my shopping list going to be from them assuming I can get my temp probes and SSR's elsewhere?

(Sory if I'm repeating myself, just want to get the initial BT order right if I go that way)
BM

The rotary encoder is what you use to input into the system, by turning left and right and pressing the knob to enter. There is video on the Brewtroller site which explains it better than that. The encoder is a panasonic and you can get them off ebay. My reason for getting it from OSCSYS is that it comes with the connector plug fitted. This connects onto the i2c board that is fitted to the back of the lcd display. The i2c board also is fitted with the socket for the encoder, and also 2 i2c sockets to connect onto other 12c components in the daisy chain. Such as the pid displays and rgbio8 boards. I already had a 4 x 20 lcd display so didn't get that item, and I already had a sainsbury i2c board, and thought that would work. I soon realised it needed lots of modification, so stumped up for the oscsys i2c board. The rgbio8 boards allow you to easily add rgb led's to your control box to display different states for elements, valves, pumps etc, ie manual, automatic, on, off. You can have a different colour to show the state. So well worth getting. Depending on how complex you want to make your system choose a the main controller to suit your needs. I opted for the DX1 as that allowed me to control up to 14 outputs, ie valves, pumps and elements. The cheaper BX1 only allows connections for 6 outputs. But it is half the price of the DX1. So if you think you would only need up to 6 outputs you may want to consider that. The software and the way it operates is the same.

If you have any questions just ask, either on here or on the BT forum. As has been said, the main legwork has already been done and it keeps evolving. So well worth considering.