Extract APA -- Dark wort

[jkp]

Hi everyone,

I started an extract + steeping grains Cascade APA last night. It's quite a simple recipe with,
Light DME 85%
Crystal 60L 15%
OG:1.057
SRM: 12
And a 60 min boil adding,
Chinook @ 60 min (38 IBU, 1.1 g/L)
Cascade @ 15 min (4 IBU, 0.8 g/L)
Cascade @ 0 min (0.8 g/L)
Cascade @ Dry Hop (2.8 g/L)
Total IBU: 42

When I transfered the cooled wort to the FV it looked rather dark, more like >20 SRM than the expected 12.
Will it get lighter after all the junk eventually fall out of suspension?

I don't really mind it being dark, but would like to know what I can do to hit the correct SRM. Have read that splitting the extract addition can help by having part of it boiling for a shorter time.

Could I also do a short boil, say 15 min or 20 min so that there is less darkening?

What about the boil, should I make sure it only simmers softly?

Grateful for any help you can give.

btw, 12 hours after pitching the yeast there is some airlock activity and the start of some foaming, so it looks fine other than the dark colour.

 

[RobWalker]

It'll get lighter once it clears out and you put it in a glass where there's less mass.

 

[Hawks]

It will get lighter as it ferments as well :thumb:

 

[jkp]

Thanks for the replies chaps!
I'll just have to wait and see how it turns out and perhaps be a little more careful next time.

It's bubbling away now so I'm happy with that.

Last night during the boil the smells were really amazing. Opening up the Cascade took me back to last spring sitting by a river in California drinking SNPA. Then when the boil got going I was reminded of walking through Newcastle or Edinburgh with the brewery stink in the air. Funny things smells. Now in the FV it doesn't smell too clever but I think that will get better over time.

 

[jkp]

This has now been bubbling away for 6 days. A krausen formed after 2 days and then gradually fell back. Yesterday it completely disappeared and the airlock had slowed, so I took that as a prompt to rack to a clean FV and dry hopped. Was that too quick? With hindsight it might have been.

It is still looking very dark. While passing through the syphon it looked like a brown ale sort of colour, but that's something I'll just have to live with and try to correct next time.

I took a gravity ready and I was a little surprised that from the start point of 1.057 it was now at 1.035 :shock: . Seems a little high to me especially as the fermentation has slowed so much. In the clean FV it is still active but much slower ~ 1 bubble per 2-3 mins. I'm a little concerned that it won't get down to 1.014, it seems like a long way to go from here.

 

[pittsy]

You may have under pitched the yeast at the start (maybe) i take it the brew has been warm enough (from where you are) so only dropping to 1035 suggests the yeast are struggling in 6 days but another 6 to 7 days may short that in itself but if not you can pitch more yeast .Or you can just pitch some now .

 

[jkp]

Thanks.

I just checked on the temperature and that room seems to have got a little warmer recently, 24*C now . It is winter here too and pretty cold outside, but our heating is on 24/7 so the room temp is very stable. That said 24*C is a little high, I'm using Gervin GV12 which some have said is the same as Nottingham. I imagine slightly hot would also cause the yeast some problems just like slightly cold might. Should I move it to a cooler position? Should I also expect some slightly funky flavours too?

 

[graysalchemy]

It is the initial stages of fermentation which are very temperature dependent, you need to keep the wort down below 21c. However a room temp of 24c doesn't necessarily mean that the temp of the wort is 24c. But if you can keep it at a stable temp between 18-20c all the better. :thumb:

 

[pittsy]

What size was your yeast packet , 11g is wanted for a standard brew but some packets are 5g also if you just sprinkled the yeast you could kill upto 50% of it .

 

[jkp]

Just checked over my notes again and it does seem that I under pitched the yeast by 1/2. It was properly rehydrated before pitching though.

If I pitch more yeast now will it make any difference other than speed things up?

 

[pittsy]

Even though yeast multiply etc they also die off when there is too much for them to do (sort of) so i would pitch more myself . You may need a few more days so to help the extra yeast to drop out afterwards . :thumb:

 

[jkp]

New yeast went in this morning, just waiting to see how it goes now.

As this was my first batch of beer I decided to make it a small one, just in case it didn't work out. So when it came to the yeast I didn't need the whole packet, but needed to work out the correct fraction of a packet. I'd read somewhere that yeast is about 4.5-5.0g per tsp, and went by that. This morning I actually measured the weight on my scales(should have done this first time!) it was only 2.8g per tsp, so I certainly did underpitch by almost 1/2 :wha: . What a stupid mistake! :clap: Never again though!

 

[pittsy]

Just so you know most styles of beer you're better off over pitching than under pitching yeast . Under pitching can lead to off flavours from stressing the yeast (fruity in some yeasts ) stuck ferments (often around the 1020 ish ) and slow fermentations . Over pitching usually just means longer time needed at cold time to help yeast drop out more .
A vial or 11g packet is enough for a 20 (ish ) litre brew at around 1040 if an ale (lagers need more as they ferment cooler)
But larger brews or high gravity beers need more yeast .
Let us know how you get on :thumb:

 

[NickW]

I have successfully fermented out 3 23l batches at just over 1.052 with only 11g yeast sachets. And that's without rehydrating the yeast (naughty). All three fermented to expected gravity in 7-10 days. Mind you I do have temperature control so that helps

 

[jkp]

After the new yeast went in on the 15th Jan there was a slight increase in activity and a few bubbles forming around the edge of the beer. Then a day later it was back to how it had been prior to the extra yeast. Slow bubbling in the airlock and no visible activity inside. I just let it do its thing for the last 6 days. Today it is still the same, so I decided to take a reading, S.G. is now 1.032, down from 1.035 a week ago. I tasted it and of course it's very sweet with quite a bitter after taste, not great but drinkable prehaps with some carbonation.

So do I just leave it longer or add yet more yeast?
Maybe try some different yeast? I have some Safale US-05 I could use. Other than that I only have general wine or Champagne yeast.

Also, should I remove the hops I put in? They are in a hop bag, so I could just pull them out. I'm just thinking that they will make it more and more bitter.

The colour is still pretty dark, slightly reddish even, quite nice but just not the colour I planned,

 

[jkp]

After that last post I decided to take the hops out and just leave it longer to see how things develop.

Well, since then I went away on holiday for a couple of weeks and came back to find this beer looking exactly how it had done before I left. Slow airlock activity with a small amount of bubbles on the surface. The SG reading is now 1.026 which is still too high but better than the 1.032 last time. The taste is also getting better. So I guess I'm just going to leave it for another few weeks (it has been fermenting for over a month already).

It doesn't seem to be a completely stuck fermentation, just a very very slow one! Since I've added extra yeast without much joy, I'm trying to think of other reasons for this. Could this be caused by complex sugars which the yeast find difficult to process, hence taking a long time?

 

[jkp]

Ok, just to finish this thread off. I tried adding more yeast but it still didn't help much and after leaving it for quite a number of weeks it was still at 1.020 so I decided it was enough. I put it into a 5L mini-keg and had the first taste of it last night. Pretty good actually, very dark and it's lost a lot of the hoppy character due to the long fermentation time, so it's more like a dark slightly sweet/hoppy ale, very drinkable. Quite pleased with it all things considered.