Torriefied wheat and torriefied wheat malt

Discussion in 'Grain, Hops, Yeast & Water' started by trevorS, Jul 13, 2019 at 6:35 PM.

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  1. Jul 13, 2019 at 6:35 PM #1

    trevorS

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    are they the same thing in Greg Hughes yorkshire bitter he calls for Torriefied wheat and in a later recipe he calls for Torriefied wheat malt?
     
  2. Jul 13, 2019 at 6:51 PM #2

    terrym

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    Torrifying is a process which crushes the grain in a particular way. Torrified wheat has not been malted i.e it's just processed wheat, but is used by brewers for head retention (e,g Black Sheep Brewery use up to 10% in some of their beers). Wheat malt has been malted. TW has no diastase so will require mashing with a diastase containing grain. Wheat malt has its own diastase so will not require mashing with another grain, although it is more usual to use it with malted barley rather than on its own for brewing beer.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019 at 7:07 PM
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  3. Jul 13, 2019 at 8:04 PM #3

    Rodcx500z

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    Jeez I have a lot to learn, looking forward to the journey lol
     
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  4. Jul 13, 2019 at 8:45 PM #4

    GerritT

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    You read Greg Hughes: you're apparently further on your journey than you thought :)
     
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  5. Jul 13, 2019 at 8:50 PM #5

    terrym

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    You might find this helpful then
    http://howtobrew.com
    I have a later copy of the book but this is still very useful, if a little difficult to navigate.
    And on the subject of books Greg Hughes and Graham Wheelers books are simpler but do contain lots of recipes. Your local library might have copies, mine certainly do, so you can try before you buy. athumb..

    PS Just beaten to it by @GerritT post so we are all on the same wavelength
     
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  6. Jul 13, 2019 at 8:57 PM #6

    GerritT

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    dammit
     
  7. Jul 13, 2019 at 11:07 PM #7

    Rodcx500z

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    Cheers Garrit and Terry looks like I have a lot to look forward to, today I filled my kettle to the 30 litre mark with water and turned it on it was reading 16c it took 1 hour to boil at this point I knocked it down to 1600w and it held the boil I then knocked it down to 900w and it held a gentle simmer is that enough for the 60 minutes, I doubt I will fill it that high while brewing so I think 900w should be ok, I am basically trying to get all this stuff in my head before I do my first brew, the dead space under the tap is 1.5 litres, I also know having worked in a craft bakery for 30 years that once the yeast is activated there is no going back and no shortcuts so sometime next week the first brew shall be done, happy brewing
     
  8. Jul 14, 2019 at 6:28 AM #8

    Gerryjo

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    It will depend on what you want to end up in your fermenter i.e (5,10,20 litres etc) which you will then need to factor your loss to deadspace.Then to add to that you have your boil off which will depend on your type of boil and length required be it 30,60 or 90.
    As you have already dialled a few factors in so far you should refill to your max allowing for hotbreak space then measure your boil off rate using a stick for simplicity at timed intervals marking as you go along then when your boil has finished use your indicators to deduct your rate.
     
  9. Jul 14, 2019 at 8:25 AM #9

    Rodcx500z

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    Cheers Gerry, I will mainly be doing anywere from 15 to 21L, today I am going to make a measuring stick using an old steel ruler, water loss will be based on 1L per kg of grain and 5L per hour boil off for first brew, then I will see what I get in the fv and work backwards from there, thanks for advice and happy brewing
     
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  10. Jul 14, 2019 at 11:32 AM #10

    trevorS

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    Thanks for that so they are not the same!
     
  11. Jul 14, 2019 at 12:10 PM #11

    foxbat

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    To be able to get your quantities right for brew #2, take these measurements on brewday:
    1. The total volume of water you use for mash and sparge.
    2. Pre-boil volume (the volume of wort in the boiler after the grain is removed and sparging is done. Basically right before you switch the heat on to boil.
    3. Pre-boil gravity (gravity at the same time as #1). Note the temperature of the sample because it needs adjusting to 20C using this Brewer's Friend calculator.
    4. Post-boil and chill volume (after chilling has been done and any hop bags removed. i.e. just before you open the tap to drain to the fermenter)
    5. Post-boil and chill gravity (gravity at the same time as #3)
    6. How much you leave behind in the boiler. This won't be much, you could probably measure by tipping it into a measuring jug.
    You should also measure the temperature of the mash at the beginning after a good stir and also at the end so you know how much you lose during the hour.

    If you get into the swing of taking these basic measurements then when you use recipe builder software in the future you're much more likely to brew what you actually intended to!
     
  12. Jul 14, 2019 at 1:28 PM #12

    Rodcx500z

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    Thanks Foxbat appreciate it, I already filled and drained it then tipped wot was left under tap into a jug 1.5 literes
     
  13. Jul 14, 2019 at 6:37 PM #13

    GerritT

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    Graduated pots and pans are lifesavers.

    My watering schedule, for 16 liters in bottles. So I need 18 in the fermenter. Gonna use 18 liters as base for the recipe.
    Most of the times it's about 1 kilo of grain per 4 liters.
    So it's probably 4.5 kilos of grain. Each kilo claiming 1 liter of liquid when removed, but that's for later computations, and each kilo taking up 1 liter in the pot.

    I have a 20 liter pot, but want to keep at least 25% headspace, AFTER removal of the 4,5 kg grain.

    So I heat 11 liters of water (20 - 25% - 4,5, round upwards).
    That's a grist/liquor ratio of 2.4, ought to do it.
    11 liter for the mash, but losing 4.5 liters after grain removal, leaving 6.5 liters of liquor.
    Using 7 liters for rinsing, ending up with 13.5 liter.
    Boiling for an hour or so, leaving 12 liters.
    Losing another liter or so during moving and filtering to fermenting bucket.
    Makes 11 liter of very hot very sugary liquid (gravity around 1080).

    Adding 7 liters of cool tapwater topping up to 18 liters. Drops the temp by 30º-ish, dilutes to 1050-ish.

    So effectively I manage my water household from the bottom upwards, where @foxbat starts with the maximum and aims to end at the right volume.
     
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  14. Jul 14, 2019 at 7:44 PM #14

    Rodcx500z

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    how does this look, not a clue if this works, ignore this
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019 at 7:59 PM
  15. Jul 14, 2019 at 7:50 PM #15

    Rodcx500z

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    b]experiment x[/b] (Standard/Ordinary Bitter)
    Original Gravity (OG): 1.061 (°P): 15.0
    Final Gravity (FG): 1.015 (°P): 3.8
    Alcohol (ABV): 5.99 %
    Colour (SRM): 7.4 (EBC): 14.6
    Bitterness (IBU): 38.7 (Average)
    76.92% Maris Otter Malt
    19.23% Munich I
    3.85% Flaked Oats
    1.3 g/L Citra (11.1% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
    1.3 g/L East Kent Golding (4.7% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Aroma)
    1.3 g/L East Kent Golding (4.7% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Aroma)
    0.8 g/L East Kent Golding (4.7% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma)

    Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes. Boil for 60 Minutes
    Fermented at 20°C with Safale US-05

    Recipe Generated with BrewMate
    how does this look for a first brew
     
  16. Jul 14, 2019 at 8:04 PM #16

    foxbat

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    Personally I'd bitter with something cheap and smooth like Magnum at 60 minutes. Citra's reputed to be quite a harsh bittering hop and if you've got some I'd save it for use as a late addition or dry hop in an American-style APA or IPA where it really excels. Otherwise, thumbs up!
     
  17. Jul 14, 2019 at 8:09 PM #17

    Rodcx500z

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    Cheers Foxbat, will do, how do I knock the abv down would sooner have it around the 5 mark, this will be my first all grain sometime this week
     
  18. Jul 14, 2019 at 8:24 PM #18

    GerritT

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    Recipe-wise it would work, IBU/OG-ratio looks good, 63-ish, normal IPA, but as already mentioned Citra is not a goto-hop for bittering. Same goes for Chinook for instance, rough on the edges when bitter.
    Magnum or Taurus could add a more interesting bitter, Fuggles a bit more alike bitter (boring perhaps even).

    First brew? Check Greg Hughes page 115 and onwards. About 5 basic recipes with 2 malts (rock solid) and single hops, but differing per recipe. Get the opportunity to get to know a few hops very well, at the same time working on your routine. Not the most exciting way, but remember: reliability and predictability means boring, up to a certain point.
     
  19. Jul 14, 2019 at 8:29 PM #19

    Rodcx500z

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    Cheers Gerrit, I have fiddled with and come up with this

    Recipe Specs
    ----------------
    Batch Size (L): 21.0
    Total Grain (kg): 4.700
    Total Hops (g): 100.10
    Original Gravity (OG): 1.050 (°P): 12.4
    Final Gravity (FG): 1.013 (°P): 3.3
    Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 4.91 %
    Colour (SRM): 6.1 (EBC): 12.0
    Bitterness (IBU): 25.5 (Average)
    Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 70
    Boil Time (Minutes): 60
    Grain Bill
    ----------------
    4.000 kg Maris Otter Malt (85.11%)
    0.500 kg Munich I (10.64%)
    0.200 kg Flaked Oats (4.26%)
    Hop Bill
    ----------------
    39.9 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (1.9 g/L)
    25.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Aroma) (1.2 g/L)
    25.2 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Aroma) (1.2 g/L)
    10.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (0.5 g/L)
    Misc Bill
     
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  20. Jul 14, 2019 at 10:30 PM #20

    GerritT

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    Looks like an English Pale Ale to me! Your EKG is 4.7% while the book has 5.5%, so you had to move some late hops to the beginning to get your IBU's, but looks quaffable to me.
    Two options still:
    -remove 10% from the water and the grains in the recipe, so in effect it will look like you have 10% more hops
    -taste the brew after 10 days of fermenting, if it's 'meh' you could dryhop with 25-50 grams (page 63) of Citra.

    Your thoughts?
     

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